Sony PMW-320 issue

Douglas

Well-known member
I've already asked our Sony reps over half a year ago (with a "we're working on it" response) about the following:
I don't expect any camera company to ever build a camera that does not have plenty of shortcomings and things I would change. Your list of complaints and suggestions doesn't even overlap onto my list of dozens of things I would do differently if I was in charge.

But that doesn't change the basic message I am trying to preach in this thread:

1) Learn to use your camera's important features and functions especially the new ones that you may never have had before.

2) Create a good PP yourself or get one from someone else who's judgement you trust and actually shoots for a living.

3) Customize the zebras, peaking, clip naming, on-screen displays, assign buttons, white balance, etc.

4) Turn off all automatic functions.

5) Find ways to work around the shortcomings or things you don't like.

6) Stop complaining about the results you get and blaming the camera if you don't do steps 1 - 5.
 

Douglas

Well-known member
The audio meters on the LCD are pretty useless.
That's because they are confidence meters and not true audio meters. If you want to see what your real audio settings are, you need to use the corresponding status display page that fills the screen from edge to edge and has registration markings. There isn't enough room in the EVF for that kind of detail. When I want to see my actual audio levels, I toggle the status button.
 

Lensmith

Member
Also, you don't need scopes or charts to set up a camera. I have done it many times with nothing more than a 40" consumer Bravia TV. Light a nice table top scene with bright whites, deep blacks, bold colors, and detail. Now dial in the settings until you like what you see. Go out and shoot shoot some test footage in the real world. Evaluate the test footage. What don't you like about it? Adjust the settings as necessary. Rinse and repeat until you are happy with the look of the camera.

Forget about scopes, charts, and production monitors that cost as much as a car. If the picture doesn't look good on a decent consumer TV, then the PP needs some tweaking.

And sending the camera out to a third-party for setting up is a waste of money.
You're a guy after my own heart Mr. Jensen.

It's always a little scary to delve into "the unknown" when one thinks it takes a lot of fancy electronic gear and an engineering degree to achieve a goal...when all it really takes is a little confidence and the willingness to learn. Not to mention...trust your own eyes!

Thanks again! ;)
 

focusthis

Well-known member
Date still messed up

Now that I'm back to work, and have the camera sitting next to me, I'd like to address the exposure argument I'm having with my camera. It looks like it's the viewfinder that is automatically adjusting brightness. I pointed the camera at some clouds and snapped the iris (with my own fingers, like a pro) from a good exposure, to washed out, then back a few times. I noticed that my perceived brightness of the VF dimmed slightly once the scene became blown out. That change was registered by the histogram (not so professional) as well. The info characters displayed in the VF didn't seem to change brightness, but I'm only 99% sure of that. Now, I could very well have been remembering a complaint I had about the Iris Override that I discovered 6 months ago when I read the manual. Perhaps my eyes glazed over. So, sorry about that little bit of confusion.


canukcam- Thanks for the link. I printed some pages out and hope to spend some time on that at work today.


Douglas- Thank you for your input on this new-to-me camera. My situation is that I'm a staff photog for a mid-market TV station. My former camera was a DNW-9WS. Our new cameras were setup by our engineers. The waveform/scope we use is part of the Edius6 we edit on. If I need to color correct some video, I tend to use those LCD computer monitors instead of the TV set also connected to the editor.
I'll be the first to admit that any bitching I do about them is bitterness about missing my old Cadillac, and given a new Chevy. I LOVE the better audio, how frugal it is on batteries, and how it's operation is practically SILENT. However, there are plenty of things about the new camera that aren't better than the old one. That is exasperated by the fact that two chief complaints I have deal with two major components of the camera that I need to trust, viewfinder and lens. I don't feel it's necessary to compare resumes. I assure you my abilities are above that of using the "EZ MODE" (WTH? Are there other pro cameras with a button labelled that??) I did read the manual, and I did skip over most of the Paint settings. So, I think you were being a jerk calling me out as if I just walked out of Best Buy with this rig and left it on EZ MODE. Perhaps that's taking an Internet argument too seriously, and I should let it pass. But when you literally sell yourself as a resource for getting the most out of a camera, and then say "I don't know what every menu does and I don't care. My eyes glaze over anytime I try to read about some of them.", the doubt creeps in. If you want to continue discussing Paint settings with everyone else, I'll bow out and check back later. I really just wanted to ask if B-rollers had noticed a problem with the date/time. I'm glad nobody got ruffled about the crappy viewfinder glass, or even the idiotic macro. I must have touched a nerve with you about the individual camera setup I was given. I really didn't expect such a heavy-handed reply. So, as Sergeant Hulka would say: Lighten up, Francis. Let's get past this, okay?
 

Shootblue

Well-known member
TLCS might be on, causing an issue...

White limit? (Doubt it)

Something related to auto iris menu settings (I assume it is always in manual)
 

focusthis

Well-known member
TLCS: Standard

There are some menu options not listed for me. I'm not sure if any hidden settings can explain what I'm seeing.
 

canuckcam

Well-known member
That's because they are confidence meters and not true audio meters. If you want to see what your real audio settings are, you need to use the corresponding status display page that fills the screen from edge to edge and has registration markings. There isn't enough room in the EVF for that kind of detail. When I want to see my actual audio levels, I toggle the status button.
Doug, I really like your insight into things but that sounds like a line from Sony. The 700 VF also has square blocks (and fewer blocks at that) for the audio meter but changes from grey to white at where you set the audio reference level in the menu.

If I'm setting levels with tone from my wireless, then I can glance over at the LCD at the back. But if you're VJing it in a scrum, you're holding the mic in one hand and the camera in the other. All I want to do is look at the meter and adjust the audio pot on the front of the camera so I'm hitting the ballpark. I'm not about to toggle consumer-style menus while I'm shooting.
 

Shootblue

Well-known member
I looked over the manual and TLCS sounds like it might be the issue...without a camera in hand, I can't be sure as to how it turns off. Maybe Doug knows... Some cameras have the DCC feature that can cause pulsing and adjustment, might make sure it is off.
 

focusthis

Well-known member
ShootBlue: There is an option to turn it off. It's not so much of a problem as to lose any other benefits of that feature (if any). Recorded images typically come out looking much better than I fear in challenging situations.

Any thoughts on why my digital extender is greyed out? I have the 320 with kit lens. Double secret engineering menu option, or does Sony acknowledge the kit lens isn't good enough to enable that feature :D? IIRC, the B-roll consensus was it's better to crop it in post.
 

Shootblue

Well-known member
I believe that it is an add on board option, so I'm guessing it is greyed out because it isn't installed (aka not bought with the cameras, though it can be purchased by itself)
 

canuckcam

Well-known member
It'll cost ya $1500 - the digital extender feature is part of the studio configuration board. No one including the Sony reps that came to show us the camera has been able to explain why those options are together. But they are.
 

Douglas

Well-known member
Doug, I really like your insight into things but that sounds like a line from Sony.
:) Yeah, I know it sounds like a line from Sony, but I'm just telling you how I actually use the camera. I'm not sure what their official line would be. I once had someone at Sony tell me that if I didn't like the way the viewfinder on the FS100 can't be titled down when the camera is over your head, I should mount the camera upside down on the tripod and flip the video in post. I'm serious.
 

Douglas

Well-known member
I really just wanted to ask if B-rollers had noticed a problem with the date/time. I'm glad nobody got ruffled about the crappy viewfinder glass, or even the idiotic macro. I must have touched a nerve with you about the individual camera setup I was given. I really didn't expect such a heavy-handed reply.
But you didn't just ask about the date/time issue, did you? You had to make some off-hand remarks about it being a "dissapointing camera" and then saying in later posts:

Quote: "I realize this might be addressed by pouring over the setup menu. However, I don't have any monitors that I trust."

and

Quote: "As for the highlights, I wish the camera wouldn't override my physical input. If I open the iris, it makes changes elsewhere.... it's that level of consumer grade functionality that gets on my nerves that I can't fully disable."


Well, do you really expect those of us who have actually invested our own hard earned money into one of these cameras to sit by and watch while someone else who clearly does not understand the camera or care to learn about it denigrates them? Maybe it doesn't make a damn bit of difference to a staff shooter at a mid-market TV station who hasn't put his money on the line, but for those of us with clients and resale value to consider, we don't want to see the camera blamed when it is not the camera's fault.

I'm not saying the camera doesn't have some faults, but some of the things you are complaining about are easily remedied with a little effort. I tried to point you in the right direction to finding a solution but I guess that offended you somehow. If you're not interested in mastering the camera and getting better performance out it, that is fine. I just don't think you should blame the camera for things it is not responsible for.
 

focusthis

Well-known member
Douglas: In a way, I was following your advice to not do more harm than good by digging into the Engineering menu without fully understanding what those settings do. I concede that to our station engineers.

I think Nino made a great point that buying a piece of equipment is a market-driven choice. Someone that doesn't want to see the camera blamed for something that's not it's fault may be taking it personally. "My Doberman Is Smarter Than Your PMW-320" would get more of a chuckle here than an uproar. Thank you, but I wasn't offended by the guidance you have offered. It was the exclamation-marked shot about the EZ MODE that bothered me. Even though I don't pay for the cameras I have used, it initially felt like a step down to get this piece of equipment. Instead of learning what wonderful new possibilities the 320 could offer me, I had to figure out how to strip off the consumerish features to regain the professional level of control I previously had. EZ MODE, auto focus, Iris Override, auto gain, auto focus macro, more info in the VF than MSNBC can cram, etc.... Now that I've cut through the fat, I can begin to see the meat.

As for everyone (anyone??) that plunked down their own $$ to follow their dreams and feed their family with this model, I have no quarrel. Let me be clear: There was never an insult to them. BTW, the searching I did to find discussions on B-roll returned possibly 3 people that might personally own this camera. PMW-320 mentions were mostly in the context of explaining why the 350 was better, or to a far lesser extent, what a TV station considered/bought. Other options in the past ~18 months, around that price range, dominated my search results. If I were to print out the discussions about Sony's 700/800 and even the EX-3, it would choke a hippo. Threads about the 320 would be hamster cage lining. What I'm saying is, I have a camera that got a lukewarm reception, built around a platform that doesn't fit in with the demographics of B-roll members, and has some curious and disappointing quirks that I have to learn to work with. So, I posed a question to B-roll, included some character witness testimony, and hoped for a response.

...and now it's September 5th.
 

Douglas

Well-known member
Andy, thanks for the clarification.
BTW, have you checked the Time Zone menu to see if it is correct? if not, it might be the reason your date changes too soon.
 

focusthis

Well-known member
New York -5:00 UTC is what I set it on. It's not been a problem the way I organize my clips. It's just that I sometimes worry our archive system will have a problem with it, my reporters will lose something,or that other unrelated odd problems will develope. Maybe I worry too much!
 

MikeSan

Member
For me the coolest bit of tech I have has to be my camcorder. It's a Sony PMW-EX1. I save my pennies up and treated myself, and it's the best gizmo I ever did buy. The picture quality and capability of the machines in...I can't believe I'm going to say this...AWSOME!!!!

Now, I want a cage for my Sony PMW-EX1. I searched a lot for this. I couldn't find so much. CAMTREE HUNT Camera Cage for Sony PMW-F5/F55 - ARRi Standard
 
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