Yet Another Format Thread

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BluesDaddy

BluesDaddy

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My station will possibly purchase new cameras next year. I need to demo some of the new tapeless formats. I just have a few simple questions.
1. Are XDCam, P2 and Editcam the only choices for tapeless cameras?
2. Are there any major workflow problems with these new cameras to be aware of? (server compatibility, edit software compatibility, time factors)
3. What is a typical system for editing in the live truck?
4. For P2 users, tell me about the cards. How many did you buy per camera? Do you always have enough memory?
Please limit your response to personal experience... no brand-bashing, speculation or hearsay. Thank you.
 
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This response is almost all hearsay and little personal experience.

Let me preface this by letting you know we do NOT have either of these formats yet because of scared "analog-engineers", but hopefully I can take stab at a few of your questions from my demo-ing experience and HOURS of sales pitches.

1. Are XD-Cam, P2 and Editcam the only choices for tapeless cameras?
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As far as I know, and we've looked for all the options. There may be another, but would you want a JVC or a Phillips camera anyway. I'd be afraid to stray away from the big boys in a corporate type purchase.

2. Are there any major workflow problems with these new cameras to be aware of? (server compatibility, edit software compatibility, time factors)
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Short answer, yes. As far as I know, XD's having issues with Grass-Valley editors. P2's having issues with Avid. The Editcam sales people couldn't even get they're stuff to work with our editing system...and there's probably more.

3. What is a typical system for editing in the live truck?
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Laptops with whatever editing system you already have on them. I saw the Grass-Valley editor in a Laptop in San Diego and it was nice. The P2 sales guys had GV too and it worked like champ. It also worked well with the GV system we have in place.

4. For P2 users, tell me about the cards. How many did you buy per camera? Do you always have enough memory?
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I'd get at least five cards per camera and if I could get more, I'd have 10+ per camera. Five cards give you over an hour with the cheap cards and over two with the $$$ cards. More than enough for general news. The pre-record function keeps you from wasting tape in a anticipatory situation.

Once again, I obviously can't follow you're instructions, but that's my small amount of experience.

It looks like we may go with P2, but only once we have a good archiving plan. The higher-ups are afraid it won't work for us, but times are changing and they won't have choice before long.

*://///DISCLAIMER\\\\\:*
This response is almost all hearsay and little personal experience.
 
Hey Sandrat, thanks for the response. I was mostly trying to head off a bunch of people guessing at answers to those questions. Sounds like YOU have some personal experience.
 
Talk to some people from WSOC in Charlotte, they're getting P2 as we speak. I saw a friend a couple of weeks ago at a presser, and he already had his P2 camera.
 
Talk to some people at either WTVQ or WFLA, both MG shops w/ both the standard MG equipment... P2/GV

I know one of the shooters from WTVQ hangs out on here but I can't, for the life of me, think of his screen name

We demoed their gear here, and the P2/GV combo is pretty sweet... I like how you can take the P2 cards and insert them directly into your laptop and they just popped up like another drive.

[ August 16, 2005, 01:25 AM: Message edited by: SpaShooter ]
 
Originally posted by BluesDaddy:
1. Are XDCam, P2 and Editcam the only choices for tapeless cameras?
2. Are there any major workflow problems with these new cameras to be aware of? (server compatibility, edit software compatibility, time factors)
3. What is a typical system for editing in the live truck?
4. For P2 users, tell me about the cards. How many did you buy per camera? Do you always have enough memory?
Click to expand...
1. I would stick with those three. However ,Hitachi also is offering a dockable disc camera that writes .avi or .omf files I think.
2. You have to decide which editor will work with your servers, etc, etc. Chances are you may need to transcode files between them (more equipment and money).
3. Laptop computer editor in your SNG truck, we hope to have a full size deck as well to handle feeds in and to be able to just play video out over the satellite.
4. I would plan on five memory cards plus a P2 Store device in case I need more space. You can transfer files from a card to the P2 Store at 1 GB a minute.

Note: 8GB cards holding 32 minutes of video should be available next year. A tentative plan would be 2 8GB cards, 2 4GB cards, 1 4GB card dedicated to proxy video, and a P2 Store per crew.
 
This post may be late...I've been bus with Katrina stories so haven't had a chance to drop by lately...but I've been using the P2 for about a 2 months now...and It seems to be a very good format...as far as problems go...there is some lag time when ingesting...we have only two stations that we can ingest...and one of them takes what seems like forever...but it is also tied to the VOD server for our newsroom...but after getting the video into our Grass Valley system everything is good to go...as far as the cards go...I have 2 4gb cards and 7 2gb cards...my usual set up is 4 2gb's and 1 4gb...one problem that I have noticed is that the cards tend to get real hot when they are in the camera for a while...we are also suppposed to be getting the P2 stores...but I don't know when...As far as having enough memory...
 
Sorry for the late response...I've been busy with Katrina stuff...and haven't had a chance to check in lately...I have been shooting on the P2 camera for about 2 months now...and it seems like a solid format...We haven't many problems with it...but the station has been on it since March...and I just got here...anyway...As far as the cards go...I have 2 4gb cards and 7 2gb cards...and that seems to work out pretty good, however with only three photographers shooting for 5 reporters at least 3 days a week I find myself having to format my cards halfway through the day...We are supposed to be getting the P2 stores but I don't know when...The only other thing that I can think of is that on one of our two ingest stations it seems like it takes forever to download...but I think that is due to the fact that it is on the same computer that our newsroom VOD station is on...We don't currently have any type of editing on our live truck...but we are using the Grass Valley system as our newsroom editing system...also somethng to keep in mind...the card tend to get hot when left in the camera for awhile...that's all that I can think of right now...mabe more later...
 
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We have 3 4GB P2 cards per photog, plus a P2 store for everyone. With 3 cards, you can shoot 49 minutes of video, 46 with 4 channels of audio. All you have to do is manage your video intake. Do you really want to shoot over 45 minutes of video everyday? If you get 2 cards full, simply pull them out, copy them on the P2 store, and format the cards for more shooting. I've never lost video on my P2 store yet.
 
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