To upconvert or not...

[Chugach3DGuy]

Hi all, I'm looking for some opinions and reasoning here. At the Day Job, I just finished a very long and drawn-out-too-long process of editing a 2-hour long independent film. The way the deal originally worked was that once we had picture lock, I would create a DVD image for mass production. However, the director and producer are now totally convinced (by a distribution exec) that they MUST have Blu-ray... And not just Blu-Ray, but the full 1080p blow-your-mind-away Blu-Ray.

Now, that's all fine and good except for this:

The whole flick was shot on an HVX200 at 720p/24.
Final Cut Studio 2 doesn't support Blu-Ray
There is no Compressor setting for DVCProHD 1080p/24

Now, I've already explained to the client that since the movie was shot in 720p, they're not going to get any more detail out of it. However, I'm being told that 720p isn't "FULL HD" and therefore won't sell- so we need to do the whole "True HD" thing and upconvert to 1080p.

So, what I'm doing is rendering out of Final Cut through Compressor to the XDCAM HD format at 1080p/24. I can't do uncompressed because there just isn't enough disk space, and like I said above, I can't even keep it in DVCProHD because no such setting exists. Once that's done with, I'll need to transfer the file over to Adobe Encore in order to create menus and a Blu-Ray image. Is this a good way to work around this mess, or is changing formats like crossing the streams in Ghostbusters?

Or, should I just keep it at 720p and let all the BD players upconvert to 1080p themselves? Has anyone else out there in Video Editing Land experienced anything like this before? Is there really any benefit at all to upconverting video like that? To me, it seems more like a waste of time and space...

 

[Alaska_steadicam]

I can see a marketing value in it. And they are the clients, so explain the issues of quality to them, and its on them. I have a blu-ray and sometimes I catch myself watching the corner of my screen. If it says 24/1080p I am happy. Less so if 720 comes up. But you gotta assume that there are some older blue ray discs that were cut from an upressed 720 telecine.

(and just get this done, because that production company still owes Kyle money for his work on it, and new wife, new apartment in LA I am sure he could use the money)

I upconverted 'Way Up North' to 1080 for my PS3, so I can't say I wouldn't do similar. Although I did it uncompressed. If you can use something other than XDCAM standard I would use that. (XDCAM HD is of course only 35Mbs, and come to think of it its really 1440x1080, far short of 1920x1080 true HD.)

Have you tried Apple prores 4:2:2? I believe it can do a little higher bit rate 10bit HD. I use it to bring files from FCP to Apple Color if I don't have the space for uncompressed, and its works pretty good.

But obviously in this situation their goal is the small tag on the box and the confirmation on the HD screen of the 3 people who buy the blue ray disc. From what I have heard of that production, a little loss in the output might go un-noticed.

Oh, but do make sure to charge the client extra, because to 'master HD menus takes a new cross filter' or whatever excuse, then charge the boss extra, becuase the conversion, and the extra time for HD menus or whatever. If they want more 'quality' out of their disk, charge them extra for it, and take some of that home. See if they 'really need it'

 

[Chugach3DGuy]

Well, I'd say its more like a marketing ploy. I still find it surprising that people who are supposedly so much deeper into the industry than I am fall for this stuff hook, line, and sinker. It's exactly the same when I tell a client I can't use a photo because its only 160X120. So what do they do? They bring it into Photoshop, because their so cunning and sly, change the image size to 1600X1200, and then have the gall to think that I won't notice. Oh, and if that's not funny enough, one option the Fearless Leader brought up was to just burn the movie to a dual layer DVD disc and just tell him its "HD". Now, will someone please just tell me how you cannot just repeatedly bash your head into a wall after hearing that!

Don't worry, we're pretty much completely finished. I know Kyle need his money, but I need it more. That's a hard-learned lesson about taking on ANY project on a deferment basis. Because of that project, I provided the boss man 1.5 months of FREE labor. All I can say is F THAT. Never again.

Yes, XDCAM HD is only 35mbps, but then again, so is Blu-ray. Also, as far as resolution, I'm not losing anything. DVCProHD 720p records at 960X720, so it has to stretch those pixels just to get to true 720p! I wouldn't get all worked up about 1440X1080 though, there are many formats that don't use full raster 1920X1080. That pixel aspect ratio is a funny beast...

I haven't tried Apple ProRes because I didn't think I'd be able to import it into Premiere Pro or Encore. Since we need to get to Blu-Ray, its gotta come off the mac. I tried the uncompressed method, but after rendering, the file would've been at least 600GB if I only do 8-bit- and there's not enough room on any machine within a mile for a file like that.

Make no mistake, I'm charging the boss man for every minute I spend on this project. I know exactly what I should be getting when the time comes for him to cut a check, and all I can say is that it better all be there. As for charging the client extra, that deal was made before my time there, and anything involving money is discussed out of earshot. The only money related talk I hear about is how the boss is losing money over it.

Oh, and you really think that 3 people will buy it on Blu-Ray? You're one optimistic guy!