Purchase recommendations for Sony F350 EFP kit -help me out guys

[PHX Shooter]

I've been given a green light to upgrade the cameras for the company I'm working for, which is great as they currently have XL2's which I'm not a fan of. I was planning on going with a DSR450, but I may be able to go with an F-350 instead. I have to turn around corporate event footage pretty quickly, so having instant access to footage without digitizing will be a real boon to my workflow.

So if you could create an entire kit based on an F-350, what would you put on your wish list? I shoot a lot of run & gun, single shooter type of stuff so I'm looking for a solid EFP set-up that just works. You guys are the experts and have kits that work, so I'm hoping you'll share some of your favorites.

Here are things to comment on and my inital impressions:
Lens - interviews, event coverage indoors and out (any thoghts on the Fujinon 17x5.5?)
Batteries - At NAB, the Frezzi batteries looked like the best bang for the buck, IDX came in a close second
Tripod/Sticks - Liked the Sachtler DV8 and Cartoni Laser
Wireless - Lector 400/401 with Tram lav
On-camera light - Like the AB ultra lights and Frezzi, also like the Z90 LED
Monitor - How crucial? Want small LCD like the Marshall or panasonic 8".
Cases
Lit kit - Liked the Lowell Caselights, i shoot in lots of mixed lighting situations. Thinking of putting in for a basic Arri kit for sit downs.

I'm thinking also of going to a Final Cut Pro system for editing, so I need an NLE that I can depend on that takes native XDCAM HD files.

Budget is a concern, so best value is more important than the nest gear, but it needs t be rock solid. I also have to transport on the corporate jet, so I need compact and efficient.

OK, that should get you going, I need to do this ASAP, so yourr quick responses are appreciated. Help me get out of DV land!

thanks

 

[Flaca Productions]

i think the DV8 will be too small for that camera. check the sachtler website to see what the payloads are - you don't want to overload the head... i have D50 on gitzo carbon fiber sticks with a DV12 head. the gitzos are MUCH cheaper and pack down much smaller than the sachtlers. if you're looking for compact and efficient - these are it. i have Gitzo G-1548 Tele Studex Mk2's - about $825 for the legs...it might be a good place for you to save some cash for other things. also - if you take the head off, they fit in a pelican 1650 - which is something that might appeal to you.

i have the zylight z50, but might upgrade to a z90 at some point this year - its a big price difference between that and the AB ultralights - but WAY more flexible. a good investment in my opinion, but might not fit in your budget. (but if you go with the gitzos, you could get the zylight, too!)

i have the caselights and love em (2 4's and a 2 that i fly for a backlight)....smaller package than the kino's but you give up a dimmer - but you get independent control of each tube (what i call a 'poor-mans-dimmer). a bonus in my mind is the fact that they have room for (and come with) a stand in the case itself - where the kinos don't - now...its not the beefiest stand in the world, but for general, indoor work, its fine. i wouldn't think of putting the caselights up outside with the supplied stands, but its very nice to be able to just load one case with everything you need in them. if you're traveling on corporate aircraft, this would be a good thing and you wouldn't necessarily need to bring a separate case for stands.

i use caselights nearly every day that i shoot - tubed for daylight - and only use tungsten for background lights. i haven't lit a tungsten-on-the-subject interview for months...

don't forget a cart....rock-n-rollers are a good combo of size/performance.

do you already have pelicans? don't forget that stuff.....

 

[PHX Shooter]

Thanks Brian! Yeah, I saw the caselights at NAB and liked them alot, especially since everything was self contained. The stands are a little weak, but for a sit down, no biggie I guess. What I lked was that you could have 32k & 56k tubes in it along with a couple of spares, so you can turn on the ones you need. Do the two 4's and the one 2 do it for you for interviews? Love to see a screen shot of what they look like in "real life".
Too bad the Z90 won't be out for awhile. Also thanks for the ti on the Gitzo's, I'll check those out. I need to save money for the Lectro's too!

 

[Flaca Productions]

the caselites are more than enough for most stuff that i do. i just did a quick sitdown with them today and was surprised that all i needed was 2 tubes on a "4" for my key an existing window for fill and 1 tube on a "2" for an edge light (didn't fly it)

check your PMs...

 

[Graybeard]

Brian - Have you ever done, or seen, a direct comparison between the lowel Caselights, and Kinos? Aside from the flimsy lightstand do you think the rest of the system would hold up well under long term use?

 

[Nino]

Maybe I can answer this one. I owned both, the Kino Diva and the Lowel Caselights. After working with both for a while I settled with the Caselights for many reasons. There are pro and con for both units so it comes down to what’s best for you.
The main difference between these lights is that the Kino has a dimmer and the Lowel has individual switches that control each lamp. Even on this I found that controlling which lamp is on or off can have its advantages especially if you are planning to mix color temperatures bulbs.

The two main things that I don’t like about the Kino is the barndoors design that allows very little flexibility and the fact that the light is open at one end making it harder or having to take an extra step to control spills. The Kino is also larger with its carrying case.

The Caselights have reversible barndoors, a silver light intensifier on one side and black on the other. On the Silver side you’ll get a much greater output and subsequently it’s like using a larger light allowing a better wraparound effect. Also it’s easy to place diffusion material or control spills on the Lowel barndoors. The longer barndoors will place the diffusion material further from the light source resulting in a better diffusion.

You can see some of these lights in action on EFPlighting.com, more on these lights is coming soon.

 

[Run&Gun]

Tripod: The Sachtler Speed Locks are very nice sticks. I just got a pair last week and I really like them. I'd go with a bigger head, Sachtler 18, Cartoni D600 or Vinten 100- something that can handle a 35 to 40 lbs. payload. You don't want to be working at the top-end of the heads limits.

Batteries: The most watt/hours per battery that you can afford. I've always used A/B's, but I've had problems with the HyTron's after they get age on them, so I'll hold back on a full recomendation for the 140's.

Top-light: I've always liked and used a Frezzi, but I'd like to see the new Zylite in action, but you can't go wrong with a Frezzi.

Wireless: I'd go with the Lectro 411A Rx and LM400 beltpack TX(they have also have a new 250mW beltpacks now, UM450) and UH400A plug-on TX and Sony 77's or Sanken lav's and not the Trams(never been a fan of 'em).

Monitor: Field friendly and has a good picture, the Panasonic BT-LH900A.

Lights: I use Arri and some Lowel, but I carry most of my stuff in my truck and don't have to worry about size and weight on the corporate jet , so I'll defer to someone else about Caselights and Kino's.

Lenses: Don't go middle of the road(17x, 18x). Buy either the longest or widest. I have a Fuji 13x4.5 on my VariCam(not sure what the 1/2" version is) and I love it. But it will bite you if you have to shoot anything kinda tight from further than 20 feet. Go with a 22x or an ultra wide. My 2 cents on lenses...

Good luck and enjoy your new gear.

 

[F4 Fan]

What's the budget?

You don’t say anywhere just exactly what your budget is going to be. I find it a little strange that the company you’re working with/for would go from a 5K camera to a 25K camera(s) plus another 25K worth or equipment and software. Maybe you’re working with INTEL of some company that has government defense contracts, but for most companies they are going to be more than happy with a Z-1U or equivalent. I’m not trying to rain on your parade but you also shouldn’t present your employer with a budget that might cause so much sticker shock.

But as to your question – get a lens if possible that has a doubler. Nothing worse than being stuck in the back of some room taping a speech or presentation and the tightest shot you can get is waste-up. Then get the best tripod you can afford, get one with a center spreader, I think they are more stable. If you do record a lot of speeches and presentations you might consider a servo- zoom along with your lens. Really makes operating the camera and focus much easier.

Consider 2 wireless microphones. You never know when you might be asked for a 2-shot type interview or heaven forbid your mic goes south on you for some reason. At the very least have a good stick-mic on hand.

As for lighting – while the fluorescent style lights are all the rage, they aren’t real portable for travel. I might be old fashioned but a good 2- 3 light kit with Chimeras and correction gels or dichroics may be a lot easier to travel with and quicker to set up. That’s just me – I don’t know what you normally shoot or how the footage is used, but I doubt that you are shooting for 60 Minutes. As for a headlight, yeah Frezzi is about the best, get one with a dimmer and a dichroic and you are set. I just got a Zylight and while it’s very versatile, I’m a little skeptical if the output will be enough, especially for something so pricey.

Just about every one at least in the corporate world edits on Final Cut Pro. While I have no experience with it, the editors I’ve spoken to say it’s far more intuitive than AVID. I like intuitive stuff.

Come down from the mountaintop and really examine the type of shooting you do and how the footage will be used. Good luck.

 

[Flaca Productions]

mr. beard,
nino is right (again)...
i use the kinos at a local studio that i frequent and i will admit that i like the dimmer, but i've never had a situation with the lowels where i yearned for a dimmer over the separate switches.

let me know if you want to see em in the flesh...you're down here, right?

 

[PHX Shooter]

Thanks for the comments so far. As for budget, my "moutaintop" isn't as high as you might think (I work for an "interesting" company). Given the quality level we need to pitch our product, I don't see why I shouldn't pitch for a package that's at least as good as the average shooter we'd hire. The desired results are the same.

I was really thinking of pitching the DSR-450, but after going to NAB and getting funny looks when I asked about SD products, the future is pretty clear. I might as well propose a package that has a decent lifespan so it's a good investment for the company. I'm not convinced going SD is the best choice.

What the hell, all they can do is say no, right?

 

[F4 Fan]

I agree - go for broke, like you say all they can do is scale back a bit. At least the DSR 450 can do 16x9 and 24 p. Still pretty expensive though for my taste.

 

[shoot da parrot]

I put a 350 package together a few months back and here is what I went with

F-350
Fuginon XS17x5.5BRM
sachtler 12sb hotpod package
Anton Ultra light 2
UM400/UCR411a lectro wireless m152 mic
Anton gold mount and dionic 90 batteries

I'm very happy with eveything

 

[Stoney]

If you go with the F350, I do not think the Fuji XS13x3.3 wide angle is a practical lens for handheld or on the fly work. It is too wide and lens flaring is a real issue. To fill the frame, you need to be inches from the subject which talent really enjoys...

Every time I write "F350" I think of a Ford truck.

 

[wtv]

Interesting post Stoney, what would you go for in the way of a wide for the F350(5) then?

I'm interested as I was thinking of getting the 13x3.3 as I love shooting with a wide.....

Any other comments greatly appreciated.

 

[PHX Shooter]

Any thoughts on the Canon KH20x6.5? A little bit more $$ than the Fujinon 17x5.5.

 

[Stoney]

WA Lens

Interesting post Stoney, what would you go for in the way of a wide for the F350(5) then?

I'm interested as I was thinking of getting the 13x3.3 as I love shooting with a wide.....

Any other comments greatly appreciated.

I would try them all out before purchasing. My guess is that the next widest, whatever is in the 4-5mm range would probably be a better choice.

Really, the 3.3mm lens was almost ridiculous. The front element is like a tennis ball sticking out and takes a huge filter size. I think we had some filters custom made by Schneider, I think 120mm sized. The flaring issues were constant because that glass ball sticks out so much and you have less depth of field with 1/2 chips. Lens hoods were almost useless.

 

[Run&Gun]

The 13x3.3 is the 1/2" equivalent of the 2/3" 13x4.5 and they both use off the shelf 127mm filters(they actually atach to the lens hood, not the lens itself). A mattebox will help with some of the flareing issues. I demo'd an Arri mattebox with a 5x5 filter and it didn't vignette on my 4.5 in HD, so I imagine the same should hold true for the 1/2" version. But I could be wrong since they have to make the lens different so the 1/2" achieves the same field of view as the 2/3".

 

[must-c-tv]

I fly all the time as London is a hub for Europe & the Middle East - and I'm a big fan of Dedo's. Sure they are big $$$, but I have never had a more reliable and sturdy light.

But I like German stuff - Sachtler, Chrosziel etc. Expensive but very well made.

The Dedo projector attachment is small & handy as well.

Photoflex makes a small Chimera for Dedo's - or you could go for a Rifa 44.

 

[Shootblue]

Speaking of SD, Sony apparently released the DXC-D55. I guess it might still have some internal applications or a limited broadcast life, but that's about it.

 

[Stoney]

Fuji 1/2" 13x3.3mm lens

The 13x3.3 is the 1/2" equivalent of the 2/3" 13x4.5 and they both use off the shelf 127mm filters(they actually atach to the lens hood, not the lens itself). A mattebox will help with some of the flareing issues. I demo'd an Arri mattebox with a 5x5 filter and it didn't vignette on my 4.5 in HD, so I imagine the same should hold true for the 1/2" version. But I could be wrong since they have to make the lens different so the 1/2" achieves the same field of view as the 2/3".

The filter for the 3.3 Fuji attaches to the lens hood, you are right. It is huge, costly, and unwieldly at 127mm. Not many grip supply stores carry them in stock, not B&H and some obvious online stores, either. I've never seen the 3.3mm 1/2" lens next to it's cousin, the 4.5mm 2/3" lens... but I would imagine that the 1/2" is built a little differently, especially the front end glass.

My point with the lens flaring is that the lens is so wide and the glass element is so near the front of the lens housing that flaring is a real battle. This camera is built for the EFP or news worlds yet that lens takes a lot of care with it's use. Who has time to baby a lens with flags, huge matteboxes, etc. when running around? I give that lens a thumbs down for that reason.

Vignetting is a constant concern, too. Any flags, or even your hand on top of the lens hood, easily creep into the picture. There is hardly any distance from the edge of the hood to showing in frame.

Additional negative for being so wide that to fill the screen at full wide you have to be, literally, four inches from someones head. Talent really love to turn around suddenly and smack their heads on that massive mattebox you need to use...