"Massive" ABC cuts coming...

[Icarus112277]

Icarus112277...

Due to a database restore, we lost your post... please feel free to repost it. It was not deleted on purpose...

Please see: http://www.b-roll.net/forum/showthread.php?t=25169

Sorry for the inconvenience.

kev

No worries.
Just wondered to make sure I didn't step on any toes.

ABC's problem that multiple layers of management redundancy.
There aren't enough skilled people there doing actual work making product, but if you can get your hands on a clipboard and a tie you qualify for a six figure job in management.


Here's a colleague's description of the meeting:

"I attended an ABC NEWS staff meeting today at 3p on the floor of TV-2. The meeting took one half hour and was run by Renu Thomas, V.P. News Operations. Todd Donovan, V.P., Technology, and Jeff Winn, Director, NIGHTLINE, were also present and added their own comments.
Renu Thomas began the meeting by stating that the changes News seeks represent a positive step forward for ABC News. The changes will ensure the collective ABC News body can go on and prosper in the future.
The following points were touched on:
John Banner is now the Executive Producer of World News, seven days a week.
Jim Murphy is now the Executive Producer of GMA, seven day a week.
Both shows will combine there weekday and weekend staffs.
Special Events will now be the responsibility of the Day Parts. For example, if a news event occurs when GMA is on the air, that event is covered by GMA.
A 24 hour a day News control room will continue to be maintained.
News Magazines will be run with a core staff and the number of free-lance employees will expand and contract with the amount of work available.
An effort will be made to reduce the number of News control rooms in any given Day Part to just one. For example, during GMA, TSS, TV-2 and Washington are all now hot. News wants to reduce this to one only. (This does not affect the HD distribution control rooms).
News will study the possibility of an automated control room for some parts of some Day Parts. At the moment they are not looking at the IGNITE system, (WABC-TV), but will explore what is currently on the market. Renu asked (with a straight face) that we all contribute our ideas to this effort
NIGHTLINE will be the model for news gathering. The expansion of digital technology will allow smaller units, including individuals to gather news in the field. News wants to put the “digital tools needed” into the hands of producers. A producer will produce, shoot and edit a story.
The need for ENG crews and News editors will continue.
Non-Union and non-contractual employees will soon be receiving a Voluntary Separation Agreement, (VSP).
Union members interested in a buy-out are encouraged to call their Union office. The company seems to be fishing for interest in buy-outs among NABET-CWA members."


Sounds like it's even worse over there than I remember it.

 

[Icarus112277]

Here's an example of "the union" at work.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzJC928rKMw

 

[Lightndp]

Union bashing is not the solution

Union dues are nothing but a tax imposed on workers to fast track their trip to the unemployment lines. Unions have lost so many members to job cuts that they're now pushing to legalize illegal immigrants and force them to join unions as a part of their amnesty so they can make up for the lost dues. Look it up if you don't believe me.

Let's remember that it is the union movement over the last century that is largely responsible for such things as child labor laws, workplace health/safety laws, the 40 hour work week, unemployment compensation, not to mention social security and medicare. It is so easy to blame unions (note also, immigrants were thrown in) during really tough times like these, and forget about the good that unions have provided.
My experience over the years has been that union dues have been at reasonable rates considering how they have help to keep the wage base for all of us in this business at a professional level. They have also kept working conditions decent when non-union shoot conditions can be de-humanizing torture.
I would suggest looking elsewhere for a scapegoat. An alternative approach would be facing the considerable balkanization of the mass audience, and the need for more multi-faceted high quality DP's.

 

[Nino Giannotti]

Americans are lazy. Surely we can all agree on that. Hey, that's a compliment to our system if you look at it objectively as we've been allowed to be so. This is why unions were created.

I would like to point out that this criticism of American workers comes from a man whose typical accomplishing and intelligent productivity consisted in taping his toy camera to the handlebar of his bicycle and proudly showing the results here.

Grinner, the problem today in this country is not the lack of productivity, is the lack of intelligence and education, and you are the poster child. The only thing that exceed your stupidity is your ignorance.

 

[dhart]

One man vs two person crew (camera/audio). I've worked both and I'll take a 2-person crew any day of the week and the end product IS better. One person doing both picture and audio is extremely limited in the sound he or she can capture, unless Micheal has a course on how to hold a camera and a 12' boom microphone at the same time

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the field "producer" was supposed to be well "producing" the story, not running around shooting pictures and gathering sound. At the network level, the field producer is sweeping the way in front of the crew so things go smoothly and efficiently. IMO, it would substantially slow the news gathering process if the producer is charged with picture/sound gathering. Maybe okay if the story is about cute little kittens up a tree, but unacceptable if it's a major breaking story.

As far as let's say Terry Moran of ABC News going out and shooting; you've got to be kidding! What's the guy's salary $350-K plus? And he's going to be spending his time as a photog/soundman? I'll believe it when I see it.

Finally glad to hear the network is going to use more freelancers. Good news for us... freelancers What's really expensive, is flying three or four people with gear around the country on last minute air fares.

The reason for all this "cost cutting" is declining viewership. I think we're at a point when the good old "evening news" is going the way of good old the "evening newspaper". Cable news is where most people turn to for breaking news. Evening news audience is heavily weighted age 55+. And just like "MASH" or "Cheers" someone's gonna come along and finally pull the plug. I guess my point being, if network news starts to look like a local cable show, why bother?

 

[grinner]

Nino, man I'm not sure what I did to ruffle your old feathers but you seldom add to discussion. You just throw stones at folks and babble about gigs 4 decades ago. You can resort to childish name-calling if you like but I dare say you don't pay union dues in trade for lowass pay either. Over and over you agree with me while screaming out loud how much you don't.
I really think retirement would do ya good. You are one fussy dude. Cheer up, man. There is planty of fun to be had out there.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled I'm totally surprised another network is laying people off thread.

 

[David R. Busse]

What's happening at television network news divisions is no different than shakedowns that have occurred over the years in industries like railroads and airlines.

A good friend grew up wanting to be a locomotive engineer on sleek passenger trains. After high school, he got a railroad job and told his co-workers of his plans. "When you have enough seniority, there won't be any passenger trains for you to run. People aren't riding trains anymore..." he was told.

So he kept working as a switchman at night and took flying lessons by day. At 23, he got his big break and got picked up by a major airline as a flight engineer; then first officer and finally captain. For 30 years he lived the good life making a pile of money and flying all over the world. For the last seven years of his career, the job became "just a job" with furloughs, salary cuts, early retirements, corporate bankruptcy, empty planes, 9-11. He took mandatory retirement and couldn't wait to get away from the airline after 37 years.

"I rode a good wave..." he said at his airline retirement party. "My timing was right...I would never get into this business today."

He now works as a locomotive engineer on a short-line railroad and loves it. In a full day, he makes less than his hourly wage in a 767.

I can retire from TV news in 11 months,at age 54. Don't plan to do so, but I'll bet when retirement day comes, I'll say the same thing as my friend Steve, about riding a good wave.

That railroad job of his looks pretty good...

 

[Chicago Dog]

Nino, man I'm not sure what I did to ruffle your old feathers but you seldom add to discussion. You just throw stones at folks and babble about gigs 4 decades ago.

That was funny.

Do you two idiots want to know why so many threads you're involved with become derailed? Neither of you can shut up long enough to take in very valid opinions that contradict your own uneducated beliefs. Instead of considering why you might be wrong, you both team up with each other in a disgusting effort to stroke each others' egos.

I'm embarrassed to be a member of this forum because you two amateurs are turning it into another version of TVSpy's Watercooler.

Congrats on destroying yet another thread, you worthless jags.

 

[Nino Giannotti]

That was funny. I think Nino is going through Tim Tebow seperation anxiety now that he doesn't have those interviews to shoot anymore. Poor guy. I'll give him credit though. When it comes to lighting, he's one of the best in the business. However, after watching some of his videos on YouTube, he doesn't do work any better than most out there.

http://www.youtube.com/user/EFPlighting

I saw plenty of shaky shots in the "K-9 Academy" and "Autumn in New England" that looked like they were suppose to be on a tripod. Sorry Nino but you want to rip on us so its time you get a dose of your own medicine. I'm not impressed by these videos.

Not that I have to explain to you about something that you don't like that was done long before you were born. Whatever shortcomings are on those old videos that you don't like they are still far superior than those that you both are too embarrassed to show.

If you would had seen my post in the past about those video then you would know that after many years on the shelf I took them out and posted them only after that I've seen the type of work being done today. For years I didn't want to show those, until guys like you came along, then suddenly they started to look good. Those were intended to show to Rosenblum and al the VJ supporters that the OMB wasn't anything new, it was done long before most VJs today were even born.

As far as Tebow goes, I'll be spending another 3 days with him this week on a special feature that we've been doing for ESPN, and yes, we have become good friends over the years. Since he was recruited to UF 4 years ago my billing on assignment on Tebow alone exceed $200K. UF is only one of my responsibilities, I also have The Magics, the Rays, The Lighting, The Bucs, USF, UCF,

What's going on here on B-roll is just for amusement, it doesn't effect business whatsoever. As most might have noticed I stopped wasting my time trying to help people, too many idiots like you and grinner where trying to teach anything intelligent about this profession would like giving gourmet food to a pig.

Last year it was a record year for me, at 64 I had 220 days of HD productions, that's at over 2K per day, you do the math, plus I gave away more than 100 days of multi cameras shoot and multiple booking. This year I'm already 10% ahead of last year and judging from the advance planning on upcoming features that I'm already getting from my clients this will be another record year.

I'm saying all this to you because I want you to realize that you are nothing more than a couple of amateurs trying to talk professionals. I've seen your kind come and go over, I know your level of intelligence and skills and I know what it takes to make it in this business, you don't have it. In two years or less you'll be looking at McDonald for a job.

There were a lot of good professional on this board that really helped people improve the quality of their work and subsequently improve their revenues, most are gone because they felt they were wasting their time with idiots like you, we don't need this crap, our career is all set, you are the ones that needs help, but you are too damn stupid to even know that you need a lot of help.

 

[Icarus112277]

Unions. They have a way of making the lazy feel they get more money by paying dues than by doing better work. In thend, they really offer no service, as we see in these layoffs. They just stipulate a rate few would work for then weeze payment for pretending to play agent.

You don't know what the **** you're talking about, or perhaps things work differently in a bigger market than they do out in cow-tipping country.

 

[AKinDC]

This whole thread amazes me.
I've been on this board almost ten years now, and if I had started this topic back then, it would have been full of sympathy for the people that are about to lose their jobs. Now, it's full of comments from idiots who feel that the only way to make themselves look good is to insult and belittle those that are far more experienced and talented than they will ever be.
For all of you that have piped up to brag that you're better then the network photogs and editors that are about to be fired, grow up. It makes you sound like a kid on a playground bragging that "my dad can beat up your dad." The job of a network photog is far different from that of a local photog, and until you actually experience that, your comments just speak to your ignorance.
For those of you blaming the unions, wake up. The cuts come because of massively declining advertising revenues, and if you think the unions are anything more than a blip on the network's financial radar, you are mistaken.
Try to remember that these are real people, with real families that are about to lose their jobs. I hope you're proud of the way you're treating them.

 

[grinner]

I don't think anyone is blaming unions for layoffs. Protection was simply brought up by some who thought unions do such a thing in these cases. If you are in a union and happy about, I think that says it all... you are happy. Bottom line, we should all be so lucky. Some of us are... others, well, obviously not.
It's been mentioned before there are seldom victims in layoffs. In many cases, it'll be the best raise they've ever gotten.
I wish em all well. I'd see that as the first wave of others to come.

 

[Chicago Dog]

I don't think anyone is blaming unions for layoffs.

Once again, reading and comprehension skills escape the glorified amateur known as Grinner:

I find the unions to be a root of the problem.

I'm with Speed Graphic and Nino. Some of you think flexing your muscles and showing crappy videos on a YouTube channel is much more important than actually reading and understanding posts by those who have years of very profitable experience over you.

 

[Icarus112277]

I don't think anyone is blaming unions for layoffs.

That seemed to be precisely the point you and others were making earlier.
You and a few others whom I'm sure don't have the first ****ing idea what goes on inside ABC at 67th street.
What you and the other ignoramuses see out in in the field is a bare tip of the iceberg that is a huge operation, with many many problems.
The first would be the multiple redundant layers of management. Grab a clipboard and a tie and you get a 6 figure job and full bennies. Don't know **** from shinola? Even better.
Want to spend millions of dollars on an SD signal distribution system (Network Release) that will be outdated in a year or two?
You'll fit right in.
Much of the redundancy in the News division is a direct result of their management dictating certain conditions. Read the memo I posted regarding multiple 'hot' control rooms and about how management is being changed.
They will try to go the 'preditor' route, and will undoubtedly fail, as that system doesn't allow for the development of superior skills.
The news magazines are the ones who will feel it the most.
Probably good news if you freelance for one of them.

And Grinner, I get a kick out of your (since deleted) reply to my posting a Super Bowl video showing the IBEW workers.
You obviously don't know **** about production outside of a handicam and a desktop. You should stay there and keep your comments to things you know. Otherwise these guys are right- it's glaringly obvious you're a ****ing amateur who can't keep his mouth shut for long enough to learn anything.

 

[Icarus112277]

Here's how management f's it up.
Just like how everyone blames union workers for the auto industry's failings.
not that the car makers don't build cars that people want to buy or that their well-paid accountants can't balance the books...
It's hype that corporate America wants you to believe.
To keep us little guys fighting each other, instead of seeing how it really is the guys at the top screwing us all.

From wikipedia

"In 2002, ABC committed over $35 million to build an automated Network Release (NR) facility in New York to distribute programming to its affiliates. This facility, however, was designed to handle only standard definition broadcasts, not the modern HDTV, so it was obsolete before construction began. NR's biggest error, to date, is the loss of several minutes of the Dancing with the Stars results show live telecast on March 27, 2007 to 104 affiliates. The previous biggest blunder was the airing of A Charlie Brown Christmas in December 2006 with several acts in the wrong order. In 2008 ABC committed $70 million to build a new HDTV facility. NR's standard definition operations shut down in the week before the revised digital television transition mandated by the FCC on June 12. ABC only has 4 working control rooms for HDTV, and two of them are dual edit/control suites; this puts the network in the awkward position in New York–controlled shows of being unable to air network promotional advertising in HD. A fifth break studio, HD-5, was put into service in August 2009."

 

[Hiding Under Here]

I haven't read this entire thread but I did read enough to feel the need to clarify a number of misconceptions regarding how most network crews function.

When we say "network" I take that to mean ABC, NBC and CBS. Those are the traditional networks. I can see where FOX might qualify now. But CNN certainly doesn't.

There's no way that the networks send out seven people to do a typical story or live shot. The typical configuration used to be four people -- camera, sound, producer and on air reporter. If you take away the sound person, you still need three people to do a story where the on air reporter actually comes to the location and interviews or does a stand up. Unlike a local station where there is a staff infrastructure back at the home base, the typical network news story gets produced out in the field almost entirely. So the producer gets the story and starts working on it, the photographer comes in and starts shooting it, then the on-air person flies or drives in and nails down the essential elements where their presence is required.

Having a sound person is very valuable in the network news configuration. Unlike in local news where the on air reporter and the camera person generally travel in the same vehicle, or where the camera person has a sat truck operator alongside, the network freelance photographer usually arrives on the scene alone and separate from the producer or talent. They are on their own to unload the equipment and park the vehicle, so security for the gear -- which themselves they own -- is paramount. With a sound person, the network photographer can drop off the equipment, leave the sound tech with it and secure parking for the vehicle.

When a network news photographer works alone -- and they do that routinely for CBS and NBC -- they have to pare down their equipment to a much smaller package. That certainly deteriorates the quality of the story. The b-roll has less nat sound because the sound tech with the boom pole isn't there to record audio that's far away from the camera. Also, the lighting suffers because less gear is brought in and time is taken away from the lighting to focus on audio. With the lone camera person performing the setup, the whole production changes. Network reporters have, over the years, been afforded the benefit of a two person crew and their on-air images have been elevated as a result. The better the gear you bring, the more attention you are able to pay to the lighting, the better the talent AND the interview subjects look. You can tell me all you want that you can replicate what I do with a two person crew by yourself. Those of us who have worked in two person crews on network stories news know that assertion simply doesn't hold water.

Network sound techs get asked to do a lot of things that the lone photographer will never be able to replace or replicate. The elimination of the boom pole for sound is a significant loss. Compromising the audio scheme in general is another deterioration. Sound techs also provide Mp3 recordings with time coded audio for transcriptions which they upload later to FTP sites. That goes out the window. On some shows, sound techs make DVD copies of the main camera with time code burn-ins so that producers can log while flying back home to edit the story. On a long drive its a drag -- and sometimes unsafe -- to do it alone. And just losing the camaraderie of having someone along helping with the hard work adds to the already stressful job or trying to satisfy people whom you will never see and never know beyond their voice on the phone. The local photographer gets to walk into the station and shepherd their work along, maybe even editing it themselves, but certainly having associations with many of the people who will understand their competence. The network news photographer -- most of whom are freelance -- will have to go it almost totally alone because there simply is no infrastructure to offer him/her support along the way. I've worked alone from time to time. It is very difficult to do in the network news configuration.

 

[OffSticks]

CNN doesn't qualify eh Hiding? OK, whatever, you say. Ratings troubles aside, I think I can speak for my friends who have risked their lives and been injured and killed working for CNN who would disagree with that idiotic statement.

 

[Icarus112277]

CNN doesn't qualify eh Hiding? OK, whatever, you say. Ratings troubles aside, I think I can speak for my friends who have risked their lives and been injured and killed working for CNN who would disagree with that idiotic statement.

I think he was referring to the definition of a network rather than overall quality.
CNN is not a network by traditional tv terms, its a cable news channel.
He notes that Fox may be an exception and is right since they have affiliates and share certain programming and resources.

 

[Tippster]

As a de-facto Networkin the work sense? Not since they chucked out the old pros for the underpaid little chihuahuas they tried to replace them with a few years ago. Glad that didn't stick here in DC - I assume the same in NY and ATL.

Regarding what got you miffed: The definition of "network," in the classic sense is a set of O&O and affiliated stations that form a cohesive unit that air one (or more) National news broadcasts and also need support for local outlets for National news stories. Thus FOX is a Network, CNN is not.

Edit: dammit, the waxwing flyer beat me to it.

 

[OffSticks]

Ha, yeah guys I think he meant it as an insult otherwise he wouldn't have used the phrase "certainly doesn't qualify". And I disagree with your definition of network. CNN has a massive affiliate network all over the world. It may not be a "network" in the old school tradition of tube tv tri-opoly broadcast news. But I have learned the hard way that B-roll.net is a place that loves to take a flamethrower to CNN, so I don't know why I should be surprised. It's nice to be reminded why I don't post here much. Thanks!