Missouri crew arrested

[SEPhotog]

http://www.sedaliademocrat.com/News/299917660367314.htm

If there was no public around them and the cops were moving the tape back, they may have a problem no matter how long they had been there. If there was public around and media was being corralled into an area and taken out of areas with general public were being allowed to stay, they can sue for some big bucks. If faced with "we're clearing this area of everybody, move or be arrested" the producer is going to have to live without their liveshot.

[code20photog]

"News director Jeff Benscoter said he hoped that no formal charges would be pursued against the crew"

I understand what he's thinking, but I think if charges are formally levied, and the station successfully fights them, it creates case law and is yet another tool in the pocket of those of us in the field.

[FTOJRLST]

Here is a link to THE LIVE SHOT just before she was arrested. The cop was standing just behind her in the shot and moved out of frame as she started the live shot. At the end she says the police are asking them to leave.

Here's the link.....

http://www.ky3.com/news/3233176.html?autovid=Y

[FTOJRLST]

Oh yeah....I'm a believer that you CAN'T under any circumstances try to coral all the media in just one place. Where the public goes I go.

[woodsiecam]

a few KC crews saw it go down...

the police moved the tape, so the KY3 crew moved with it, back to the public side of the tape. then the officers told the crew that they had to go over to the "media area". the KY3 crew was standing with a crowd of bystanders, who were not asked to move. so the crew stayed put. thats why they were arrested.

they were told to move, and the rest of the bystanders were not.

if KY3 doesn't take this to court, it's a slap in the face to the rest of us

[Baltimore Shooter]

I hope someone else was rolling on it. I'd love to see that air.

Warren

[Bluedog]

Troopers had NO right to move them when everyone else was (general public) was standing in the same spot. ND also stated they had been there since 3:30 that morning. Why, after nine hours, did the scene suddenly need to be moved back. LUDICROUS. I hope KY3 stands up for themselves in this one! And who's this "media attorney" saying,

"The law recognizes police power. In times of emergency, they are allowed to exercise police power. ... They have the ability to tell people 'You must leave now.' If they don't, (the police) have the ability to arrest them," Ms. Maneke said.

"They are controlling a scene. It's very difficult for a judge to ever tell a law enforcement officer 'You went overboard or beyond authority.' "

Ms. Maneke advises journalists to deal with situations as calmly as possible when they arise, then "have a quiet discussion afterward."

Glad my station doesn't have her on retainer, our attorneys would have a field day with this one. A QUIET DISCUSSION? Ms. Maneke sure isn't representing the journalists side of this one.

[Spacey]

Hmm... the guys at KY3 are pretty nice, but most of them kinda young. I can see the seasoned guys fighting them, but younger ones nah. I hope no equipment was damaged, they just got new XD.

[FTOJRLST]

Originally Posted by woodsiecam

a few KC crews saw it go down...

the police moved the tape, so the KY3 crew moved with it, back to the public side of the tape. then the officers told the crew that they had to go over to the "media area". the KY3 crew was standing with a crowd of bystanders, who were not asked to move. so the crew stayed put. thats why they were arrested.

they were told to move, and the rest of the bystanders were not.

if KY3 doesn't take this to court, it's a slap in the face to the rest of us

If this is the case I hope they rolled on it! Good Grief!

[NEWSSHOOTER3]

They need to fight this. No doubt.

[SEPhotog]

they were told to move, and the rest of the bystanders were not.


Then they should go to federal court and make the state of Missouri pay big time.

[SF Camera]

In California we have our Penal Code Section 409.5 It reads like this,

409.5. (a) Whenever a menace to the public health or safety is created by a calamity such as flood, storm, fire, earthquake, explosion, accident, or other disaster, officers of the California Highway Patrol, California State Police Division, police departments, marshal's office or sheriff's office, any officer or employee of the Department of Forestry and Fire Protection designated a peace officer by subdivision (h) of Section 830.2, any officer or employee of the Department of Parks and Recreation designated a peace officer by subdivision (g) of Section 830.2, any officer or employee of the Department of Fish and Game designated a peace officer under subdivision (f) of Section 830.2, and any publicly employed full-time lifeguard or publicly employed full-time marine safety officer while acting in a supervisory position in the performance of his or her official duties, may close the area where the menace exists for the duration thereof by means of ropes, markers, or guards to any and all persons not authorized by the lifeguard or officer to enter or remain within the enclosed area. If the calamity creates an immediate menace to the public health, the local health officer may close the area where the menace exists pursuant to the conditions set forth in this section.

(b) Officers of the California Highway Patrol, California State Police Division, police departments, marshal's office or sheriff's office, officers of the Department of Fish and Game designated as peace officers by subdivision (f) of Section 830.2, or officers of the Department of Forestry and Fire Protection designated as peace officers by subdivision (h) of Section 830.2 may close the immediate area surrounding any emergency field command post or any other command post activated for the purpose of abating any calamity enumerated in this section or any riot or other civil disturbance to any and all unauthorized persons pursuant to the conditions set forth in this section whether or not the field command post or other command post is located near to the actual calamity or riot or other civil disturbance.

(c) Any unauthorized person who willfully and knowingly enters an area closed pursuant to subdivision (a) or (b) and who willfully remains within the area after receiving notice to evacuate or leave shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.

(d) Nothing in this section shall prevent a duly authorized representative of any news service, newspaper, or radio or television station or network from entering the areas closed pursuant to this section.

We use this one frequently and it works 98% of the time however if it’s a crime scene law enforcement can protect the area and give us the boot. There have been several times that I show up to a fire and the police will say “Well it could be a crime scene” You have to be very careful on how to approach the officer, he/she does not want to be corrected on law by some guy toting a camera. The best approach has been “I will need to talk to your supervisor” or PIO. In the meantime be as civil as possible but stand ground. It’s all about saving face to the officer.

Sorry for the long post everybody.

[Baltimore Shooter]

Subsection D being the important part of that, CA photogs should make copies of that and make subsection D BOLD then show it to any office w/a chip on his shoulder...while you're rolling on it of course.

Warren

[code20photog]

I actually just did a new round of press pass sized 409.5 cards for our station. We carry them with our press IDs, and in the past I've had tear-away ones that I've passed out when I get stopped by an overzealous official. If anyone's interested, I can make additional sheets you can have laminted and snail or email them over. Contact me off the list.

And like I mentioned, the ND/GM can't roll over on this one!

[Baltimore Shooter]

Yes, but that's the CA code, sadly that won't work in MD/DC area unless I can find something like that in the Annotated Code of Maryland. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to research that right now.

Warren

[Lenslinger]

... Consider this: Our democracy works best when journalists are allowed access to both the mundane and the diabolical. Fatality aside, this case ranks somewhere in the middle and the KYTV crews should have been granted a vantage point equal to that of Lurene and Larry Looky-Loo. They were not. Instead, police insisted they report to a special 'press area' where armed constables could make sure they didn't upend the bedrock of the Republic by getting a clear shot of a damaged Elks Lodge. Thanks fellas, Superman can scratch Clinton, Missouri off his to-do list!

Now, I'm not proposing members of the Fourth Estate be allowed to run amok over evidence, crime tape and first responder. But where the public is allowed to gather so should the press - be it a sleep-walking scribe with a filled-up scratch-pad or a tricked-out techie with a lens-extender and a satellite dish. It seems simple, doesn't it? Tell that to the oak tree with the badge pinned to his tit. He'll most likely point his walkie-talkie toward a far-flung spot and suggest you follow it. Sometimes when you have no choice, but no news-stalker I know walks there without a fight ... or as KYTV attornies suggest, 'a quiet discussion'. Spoken like a lawyer, one whose role it is to dodge and obfuscate, not roll up and report.

Fine - we all got jobs to do. Just as the deputy has the duty to keep a crowd at bay, the news crew has to right to penetrate the onlooker scrum so those not present can endure the view as well. That's usually how it works, but when testosterone and flashing lights reach a certain temperature, roadside logic evaporates and you can quickly find your camera and your self being pushed back to absurd distances by people who own every wretched season of COPS on special-edition DVD.

Just don't expect the magistrate on duty to appreciate the irony. Those guys can be real crab-asses.

[Terry E. Toller]

The CA law was sort of trashed by the very liberal CA supreme court. they ruled that if a police officer 'believes' that there 'may' be a crime scene, they can bar the press. So, in the types of stories spelled out in the law, if a cop says, "I think there is a crime scene in there, you can't go in..." then the law means nothing for the media.

Cops all over CA are being taught this. Their mistake is that the court also wrote that law enforcement should not take the decision as a blank check to bar the media because they would revisit the law on a case by case basis.

I actually covered a story once where lightning hit a tree and it fell onto a house. Some rookie cop said, "You have to leave, I am declairing a crime scene". I ignored him until he said, "This is my crime scene, if you don't leave, you are going to jail". I replied, "I guess I will be in good company because you will have to arrest God too." His supervisor told him to back off. This idiot learned this line about a crime scene in his training...

[Shootblue]

For what it's worth, I talked to our local HP PIO, who said he had talked to either a seargeant or the PIO for that region.

He said that the crew had been asked to move for a half hour and that the other people who were around were plain clothes officers.

I know each side has their own story, so this may or may not be accurate. No reason to doubt the guy I talked to, but stories sometimes change over time and through people.

[Dink]

The other thing nobody has brought up is that they were live. That would almost certainly involve a truck. It's one thing to demand that a photog quit shooting b-roll or that a reporter quit gathering information in a place where other members of the public are standing. It's something else to tell them to move a vehicle that is in the way, or get cables out of the way, or take down lights.

Live shots are generally pretty stationary, too. I wonder what all equipment they had out there. It didn't look like they had any lights or reflectors up. Certainly there was at least one cable. Was there a monitor set up? Was there power run out to the shot?

Does the general rule that photogs and reporters can go wherever the public goes extend to setting up live shots? Can cops not tell you to move your cables, monitor, lights and truck? Somebody mentioned another crew out there that wasn't arrested; were they also doing live shots, or were they simply gathering news?

Everybody is automatically assuming here that the cops were wrong. Were they? I'm not sure from what I've seen and read. I've worked a number of high profile events like this where the cops strictly regulated parking and locations for live shots, directing everybody to a "media area" to keep the scene free of the clutter and chaos that comes with a truck city. IF it turns out that these people were told to move their live truck to a designated media area, and they refused to do it, I'm not sure I have a problem with them getting arrested. The First Amendment protects news gathering. I'm not sure it also grants a blanket license to go live whenever and wherever you want.

[PopShaker]

I can go wherever the public can go with my camera, but I can't go everywhere with my live tuck.

I think cops get a bad rap sometimes, but they too, are just trying to do their jobs.

It's been my experience, when dealing with cops here in vegas, if you stay behind the tape and on a public area, you're golden. The problem we run into is the casinos thinking they own the sidewalks. (Technically they do own them on the Strip, but the're still a public area.) Security for the casinos always tries to boot ya. That's when I tell them to call the cops. Because every time Metro has shown up, they've sided with us.

One example of cops helping us do our jobs.