Dejero Live+ portable live unit

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PhotoJones

Member
After six weeks of testing a LiveU unit a while back we are now about to test the Dejero Live+ device. Seems like the same basic cellular bonding idea but in a much more robust case (built into a small pelican style case) and more straight forward menu.
http://www.dejero.com/products/dejero_transmitter

Does anyone who has tried this have any thoughts/pros/cons?

Thanks!
 
FTOJRLST

FTOJRLST

Well-known member
We used the DeJero box in Daytona for NASCAR Speedweeks in February.

And we also took it to LA for a few days.

I enjoyed it and it worked 99% flawlessly. (worked better later in the week at Daytona after we figured out some issues that were fixed with a reboot.)

We were able to go live when we wanted,where we wanted...even once on the start finish line of the track during a time when people were allowed out there during some pre-race activitiy. Wouldn't get that with a cable run from a live truck.

To me DeJero in particular is nice because of being able to record footage to the box's hard drive and then upload it via the connection.

The unit we decided to go with doesn't allow for that. (We FTP from our laptop via a single cellular or WiFi connection)

I also like the interface on the DeJero box..being able to see the parameters of the signals and seeing your video feed from the camera is nice.

Funny story though - at the DNC in Charlotte I saw the Secret Service pop open someone's Dejero box and they were a little concerned about it because it has a very unconventional look on the inside with the air cards and fans and wires and boards and such. The SS agent said he'd never seen anything like it.

Some of our Live Shots -

http://myfox8.com/2012/02/20/daytona-500-trevor-bayne-has-big-day-at-the-beach/

http://myfox8.com/2012/02/24/danica-patrick-wins-nationwide-pole-at-daytona/
 
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SamG

Well-known member
We have two Dejero's. We field tested them, TVU, and LiveU. Dejero was the clear leader in quality and ease of use.

Since we've had them, we have had some growing pains (we do have to cover areas where cell phone coverage is "not the best"). When the cell signal is moderate though, we have had some good looking coverage.

I'm giving them a big test this week (VP Debate), and we'll see how it does. We did get a DSL line so we're not totally dependent on cell service.

Oh, you can also use the Dejero box to FTP a file off a flash drive.
 
canuckcam

canuckcam

Well-known member
The variable is always cell tower congestion. Which usually means the bigger the event, the slower your connection since everyone is on their phones at the same time.

The question is really which unit deals with latency and poor quality connections the best. I can't answer that with numbers but between the Dejero, LiveU and Streambox Avenir, I'll say that when we tested the units next to each other at the same event, the Streambox won hands down. But afaik it's also the priciest unit.
 
FTOJRLST

FTOJRLST

Well-known member
One of the posts above reminded me of something I forgot to mention...although we didn't use the feature.

You can send your liveshot over a WiFi or Ethernet cabled internet connection.

So, if you have a fast internet signal....and at major events like the DNC or the Debates you can usually get a pretty fast cable drop.....you can push your Live Shots thru the internet.

At the DNC specifically DeJero had a private WiFi network set up just for its clients. (Maybe some of the other cellular bonding companies also did this...not the one my station uses now)
 
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PhotoJones

Member
To FTOJRLST and Sam G-more questions!

I'm curious about what wireless carrier you were using, if all four of the cards in your unit were being used on that carrier, and what city(s) you were using them in? Our 20/20 demo unit has two Verizon cards, a T-Mobile, and an AT&T card. Verizon is the best and strongest signal in our area and I'm curious if having 4 cards using that carrier would help. Our experience with the Dejero so far has caused people to call it "DiGiorno" (like the pizza) because it hasn't delivered!:( We've tried it in several places. Here, (Grand Rapids MI-2nd largest metropolitan city in the state), in our capitol city Lansing, Oakland, MI and out of state. We've had only one occasion where the signal was good enough to use (fed a pkg with it and the 5th run was "OK" but still had some minor image glitching).

I'm wondering if we have a setting in the unit that's not right or if we need to change out cards so all four are Verizon. We obviously need some tech support but when our chief tried calling the company he got a rep on the phone with an Indian accent too thick to understand. (I hope they're not using an out-of-country call center!)

Does anybody have a Dejero contact in the US that services the Midwest?

Thanks!
 
FTOJRLST

FTOJRLST

Well-known member
I wasn't directly involved in talking to the DeJero people but once and it seems like they were local people. If my memory serves me they're based in Denver.

Our engineers took care of making sure everything was set up correctly and one time while I had it in Daytona we had to ask Dejero to reset our connection because it was lagging.

I don't know if you have a choice to swap out the air cards because they provide the cards and service. But it may be worth talking to them about the service in your area that is stronger. I do remember seeing the bars on the display that show which cards are carrying what amount of the signal so that should give you some data to work with on troubleshooting.

They do have a great web presence on Twitter...so maybe try that avenue for some customer service.
 
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bfrusina

Member
Dejero Support

Hi there everyone I'm the head techie and founder of dejero. First i just want to say thank you for all the posts good and bad. I appreciate some of the feedback against the competition that we have gotten on here. And we will do our best to improve some of the things that have been mentioned.

Mark was asking for a support number for us. its 519 772 4824 ext 2
or email us at support@dejero.com someone will get back to you within minutes i'll bet you on that... our support focus organization is around getting you guys the shots and not doing multi tier support, you get the right person the first time you call or email and we call you back.

We do not outsource or manufacture any of our products overseas to make that clear i do not believe in that. All our support staff is either full time in houston texas, waterloo ontario canada and for europe , just outside of london england.

I'm very surprised that you got a person with a very thick accent on the phone all our support staff are professionals with different backgrounds but all speak very comprehensive english. We do have an office in india that is a sales office but then you can only reach that through an international number at dejeroasia, and there is some local sales engineers there but our two numbers are not linked so i'm sorry if you by any chance called that number. and support for dejeroasia is at one of those three locations that i mentioned above.

More importantly i'm concerned about the coverage that you are having, can you please send me an email bogdan @ dejero dot com and i would be happy to have someone come out there modify the cards or whatever we can do.

canuck cam... yep i know you guys tested the boxes over a year ago, a lot of things have changed i would be glad to challenge you on the stream box head to head any day. we had some problems a long time ago (a year in this business is a decade) can i set you guys up with another demo side by side just to get an opinion even if you guys don't have budget or interested in buying.
the cbc, cp24, city, chch all use us in toronto... you guys are the only ones who don't... i'm sorry about your less than satisfactory experience.

Thank you, please let us know how we can make the service and product better.

Also this is my first post sorry to make it so long...
 
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PhotoJones

Member
Thank you for your response Bogdan!

You've responded well and posted to the best place to back up your products in this business! You bet we'll be contacting you. We currently have our Dejero 20/20 unit in San Francisco following the Tigers in the World Series. (We may be from West Michigan but we have a huge Tiger fan base and their "farm team", The West Michigan Whitecaps, is from here.)

I'll forward your number and email to our shooter out there and our Chief Photographer as well. If you can get our Dejero signal near as solid as it's built, we'll be buying it! :D
 
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bfrusina

Member
Hope the training helped

Hi Mark,

i hope you were at the training session today. And i hope it was helpfull. Do you have any feedback on that?

Regards,
Bogs
 
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PhotoJones

Member
Good training!

Bogdan-

I must give you and Dejero a "thumbs up" for quickly getting a tech rep to our station to train us on and discuss our issues with the Dejero unit. The training was very helpful and the unit and server system have some excellent features that we haven't been able to take advantage of yet. (We most liked the idea of being able to share video on the portal with another station when approved through an agreement between the two). We also liked having a USB connector and internal hard drive to be able to copy and send all kinds of video and other digital media files. The i-pad app was pretty slick too!

I must also report the negatives for others to know. (And your helpful tech Neal, agreed.) First, cell congestion and system saturation will always be a problem with ANY cellular bonding system. Therefore, no shot can ever be 100% certain.

Second, the audio input is "line" level. Why?? Anyone who understands anything about broadcast television news knows that "mic" level through a balanced XLR connector is the standard. The additional split audio connector needed for the unit is one more thing to dangle, catch, break off, and loose. (This connector quickly becomes the "weak link" in the chain.)

And lastly, and this is only an issue for us and a few other stations having cameras with no digital output (HD-SDI), a composite connection to the unit is not available. Unfortunately, in our chief engineer's eyes that's a deal breaker as he doesn't want us to have to connect another box between the camera and the Dejero unit. (Again, the "weak link" idea.)

Overall it's a sturdy product with a great interface that's user friendly and some features that outshine your competitors. I believe if you can upgrade the audio input to a mic level XLR connector you'll have a real winner.

-Mark

P.S.- your unit did save one of our election live shots last night when we were having issues with a microwave signal in our ENG truck. (The 3-4.7 second delay was tricky to work around with our truck's cellular IFB but we got the shot!)
 
cameragod

cameragod

Well-known member
PhotoJones said:
Second, the audio input is "line" level. Why?? Anyone who understands anything about broadcast television news knows that "mic" level through a balanced XLR connector is the standard.
Click to expand...
No that is exactly wrong. Industry standard is Line level because that is what is coming out of the camera or field mixer.... please tell me you don't just put a mic in the unit direct... because that means you would have no local control over it and that would be very unprofessional indeed.
 
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bfrusina

Member
Mark,

first off all thank you for the kind words and the reality check of this technology. Just like you mentioned microwave trucks are also not 100% reliable. and yes that is the issue, the main difference is that no matter what you know "short of your generator failing" you will get a live shot form a previous known good spot with microwave but with cellular you don't have that certainty.

A couple of things though.

we do have composite input into the box its a bnc cable in... it does not have component so we don't handle HD 1080i input into the box currently. If need be we can modify a box specifically for you guys the capture card does handle that. Just not too many people need it or have ever asked for. so please let your chief know that i would be happy to chat with him. neil would not be the one making that decision since that is not the current product offering i hope you understand that.
but at the same time i did mention customer satisfaction is the most important thing for us so something that small can be worked on.. even though it may look honkey and we may have to give up a few things such as a usb port but we can get the 3 connections in there.


Second, the mic level, vs line level if that is a deal breaker we can help you out. typically we don't do that because it was mentioned in the past but again it wasn't a big deal, and anyways then they want to control the audio level that goes in. we can probably also work on that if necessary although frankly that was not a priority so far for us.

and third and most important you guys that go out there and try to keep the public inform do a hard job as it is. We are trying to simply this but there is not one tool can do it all. not your microwave truck not your satellite truck not your dejero not the iPhone app... you will need different tools for different situations and your assignment desk should know over time how to use the new tools that we provide. we will not replace all microwave / satellite trucks... that is simply not possible and not something we can ever do with a public shared network such as the cell network. We don't claim that, although some marketing guys do get carried a way and you may have material that we did put out that might be contrary but you will never hear me say that we 100% kill microwave and satellite trucks that would an absurd statement. On the other hand we do a lot of things microwave trucks or satellite trucks can't. So we want to be an augmentation technology to the traditional technology.

Anyways i'm glad you see the potential of the technology and we would be happy to work with you guys. I'm glad you liked neil he is a great guy. I did send you an email with my phone number i believe so please pass that on more than happy to chat and see how we can make you guys happy on the hardware if we don't have the required inputs right now.

BTW have you guys seen this tragic yet amazing video from the crew at WPIX 11 in New york the are one of our customers and i was quite impressed with video. It took them 21 hours to be able to find a place to go live from, with all the cell towers on the island down the dejero did not work, the microwave failed, the Skype video died, and finally they found a spot where to go live it was cool it was with us. but the sad part is how long it took to get the message out to the people of new york to let them know how bad the situation was at the time.
http://vimeo.com/52760964
its a 20 min video but quite interesting and i'm sure all of you appreciate what you all go through in those situations and how it really is, but how important the job is too.
Regards,
Bogdan
 
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bfrusina

Member
Somehow i think i lost my post.

Mark,

thank you for the note i appreciate the good and the real comments about our technology.

none of the technologies can ever be 100% reliable as you mentioned and out technology runs on a public shared network as such it can't be 100% reliable either. It is a limitation.
The big difference is that on a microwave truck if you know you got out of that spot before you will be able to go live again from that spot. with cellular you don't know that for certain.
but you have to admit it does provide a lot of features traditional technology can't.

We also understand that providing a range of products is very important to you guys because not one tool can do it all. a sat truck can't go live on the move and under a bridge, a dejero can, a dejero can't go live in the middle of the inauguration speech of the president most likely, but a sat truck can. the iPhone app is a very quick response tool as such you need all these tools , sat trucks, microwave trucks, dejero transmitters, iPhone software, laptop software etc... the right tool for the right live shot. as such your assignment desk will work over time to know what these new tools bring and use them accordingly.

however to your concerns,

first of all we do have composite input it's the bnc that says analog on the side of the box. We do not have component, however we could make that in the box if necessary the capture card support that we just need to make some modifications. Neil could not say that because its not part of our current product offering, but as i mentioned before customer service and support are the most important things for us as such we would be happy to discuss those modifications.

please have your chief give me a call or email me more than happy to chat with him about that and how quickly we can turn that around.

2nd the mic level vs line level convo, we can make something work on that pretty quickly too let me check on it and i can get back to you but its not something that was a priority and frankly not many people asked for it because they want to control the level before it even goes in the box so then they want line level.

PS> have you had a chance to see this video from wpix11 from new york
http://vimeo.com/52760964
it shows how sand the hurricane hit and how difficult and dangerous job you guys do sometime. it took them 21 hours to go live because microwave failed, dejero failed, Skype failed, cell phones failed... but finally they found a spot where they had some signal and they went live to give people at home the information they need about the areas that are affected.
Our friends at WABC and NY1 have done a great job covering the hurricane as well.

Regards,
Bogs
 
cameragod

cameragod

Well-known member
Sigh... in the old days we would have had 15 pages of people arguing over just what "Anyone who understands anything about broadcast television news knows" ...actually knows. :)

Now nothing... kind of takes the fun out of being right.
 
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bfrusina

Member
Well thank you for the feedback,

i have tried to make a posting yesterday but it didn't work for whatever reason.

Thank you for the frank feedback, yes our technology doesn't replace microwave / satellite trucks what it does it provides another tool in the tool box for different types of live shots.

As far as your two concerns
1st ... we have composite which is only analog, we could do component and neil could not commit to that but we can make a modified version that would support it.

2nd the line level / mic level issue yep we have got a few requests for that but not enough as it was mentioned earlier poeople like to control the volume before comming into the box. either way we could look at that too..

Could you have your chief contact me and see if we can address some of these issues immediately?


PS i don't know if any of you guys have seen this but its a great documentary put together from our friends at WPIX11... just shows how bad sandy works it took them 21 hours to get a live shot out, microwave truck down, cell tower down (aka dejero down), skype not working...



http://vimeo.com/52760964

.
Regards,
Bogdan
 
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