Photog Pay in the Southern Markets

[newsismylife]

Is this true?

I've heard that the GROWING TV markets mostly in the southern markets sometimes pay less than smaller markets in the rest of the country?

I know they aren't unionized, but why the discrepancy? One would think with all the growth in Georgia and Florida, that this would be a no-brainer.

[PhrozenPhoto]

It's called paying in sunshine... when you get hundreds of people willing to do the job because they want to live in a nice climate you can offer less money and someone out of the group will bite.

We in Minneapolis on the other hand pay in snow... the upside is you need a lot less aloe lotion when you first adjust to the new climate!

[amp]

If you are experienced and have a solid tape, push for more $$. I am happy to say my station has pushed it's average starting pay up over 50% more in the last 5 years. It was way too low to start with, but it is getting better.

[TexasDave]

I was chief in a market in Georgia. I took less knowing it would pay off in the future. The "sunshine paycheck" is very true. I've had numerous offers in the South and they pay was all in the low 20's, and sun n sand. Now I have no regrets about my southern job. It was great and I did love the beach...but sand don't pay the bills.

[A Step Above Productions]

Don't expect more than 30 grand anywhere in Florida (except for Tampa). Does not matter who you are or how long you have been shooting. I know a guy who just went to Miami for 28 grand a year.

[photogguy]

I know a guy who just went to Miami for 28 grand a year.

I couldn't live off 28-grand here in Michigan!!! Sheesh.

[f11vid]

So, I'll take some snow and a paycheck,thanks...

[LenzCzAll]

I couldn't live off 28-grand here in Michigan!!! Sheesh.

I'm with you, I would be living in a van (sat truck) down by the river

[newsdude477]

I couldn't live off 28-grand here in Michigan!!! Sheesh.

I pretty much do!

[shade]

hey step above,

that is the root of the problem, accepting a job in Miami for 28k, once again it screws everyone.....and as for not getting more than 30k in florida, there are stations in Miami, Tampa and Orlando that do start photogs off @ 40k plus ot. I know it for a fact.

[tvguide]

28K to start in Miami? What station? It sounds a wee bit low. I know a guy who went to WFOR in Miami 5 or 6 years ago. He was a good photographer with about 10 years under his belt. They started him at 50K.

[McQueen]

I turned down a photog gig (production) in Tampa last year for $35k which was a union job...They wouldn't budge on the salary.My family lives in the area, so I Know about the cost of living there(taxes,home insurance(flood and hurricane) etc. It's not the bargain it was 10 years ago...at this stage in my career, I couldn't give up my current job(in the northeast).Think long and hard about the sunshine money...wasn't worth it to me.

[pre-set]

hey step above,

that is the root of the problem, accepting a job in Miami for 28k, once again it screws everyone.....and as for not getting more than 30k in florida, there are stations in Miami, Tampa and Orlando that do start photogs off @ 40k plus ot. I know it for a fact.



Yep, exactly. I wanna PUNCH guys I hear doing stuff like that. Way to fawk everyone, dhickhead!!!!!

[A Step Above Productions]

hey step above,

that is the root of the problem, accepting a job in Miami for 28k, once again it screws everyone.....and as for not getting more than 30k in florida, there are stations in Miami, Tampa and Orlando that do start photogs off @ 40k plus ot. I know it for a fact.

I don't know what stations you are talking about NOW. I know back 5-10 years ago some stations in Miami, Tampa and Orlando paid up near the 40's. But from what I hear that just isn't true anymore. I went out on my own for that reason. If I am wrong that is great there is nothing I would like more than to be wrong on this.

I do know for a fact that one station in Miami is paying (there are guys in Miami who have been there for 10 plus years who are making over 75 grand a year) starting off at 28 grand a year.

This all sucks

Starting saleries for all photogs:
Tampa - 32 grand
Miami - 28 grand
Orlndo - 29 grand
West Palm - 23 grand
Jacksonvilee - 26 grand
Fort Myers - 27 grand

This all comes from friends who have taken jobs in these markets in the last six months. And they all are great photogs.

Not taken the job isn't the answer because both Miami and West Palm are now hiring guys fresh out of school and any of those salaries for a kid fresh out of school isn't too bad.

[shade]

step,
I hear what you're saying and it all sucks right. As of couple of weeks ago: Tampa (withhold the station name) offered range of 40k- 45k for a position which is still open.

early 2005 fox35 offered 40k to start (orlando)

early 2005 nbc6 offered 40k to start (miami)

your buddies might be great photogs but it's all in the deal u work out and how experienced you are (not talking market size), what u bring to the table. look there is money out there, its all about being able to stand your ground and having the background to see thru a chief's/ops mgr's bull****. As for the college grads getting jobs in palm beach the station pays for it eventually with either inexperience on the streets or missed deadlines take your choice.

[A Step Above Productions]

Shade,

I agree with everything you are saying... While I was in the Fort Myers/Naples market I was one of the highest paid photogs in the market. The only reason I was paid more than most was I stood my gound, told them what I wanted and did not settle for less. It took me 6 months to get the job but I did get them to give me nearly everything I wanted.

I don't know where you are getting your info but mine and yours are way off.

The guys I know are strong experienced guys, and most of them turned down the jobs. They did not settle for the meger pay, and that is why the newrooms are taking younger guys (and yes the newrooms will and do suffer but managment does nat care it is all about the bottom line - it may not be rite but that is the fact TV is a business) young photogs will take anything they acn get.

PM me and let me know what stations you are talking about and lets see how we can be so different.

I stand by my information.

[Mr MoOz]

Ah yes the payment in "Sunshine." Something to remind them when they say that part of the pay is the Sunshine, is that sunshine causes skin cancer...

As to the green stuff, the pay is based also on the seriousness of the "hole"/shift/duties and what they like.

One top Southern Market newsroom knew me very well, as I applied/was called for several openings that they had. All ended in hiring freezes or getting someone cheaper by the way.

During those 7 years I saw the offering pay fluctuate from 28k, 35k, 18k, 33k, 27k, to as high as 49k, then ended at 23k. Same station, same Union, same Chief, same gear, just different shifts, economic climates, and News Managers in charge.

Some would say "it's a union shop, it should pay well." Well that one is a very weak one, as most of the new guys are almost all non-union, thus taking the teeth out its bargaining power when needed. Everyone wanted the bene's but not have to pay the dues.

Keep one thing in mind, ask high and be prepared to say "No thank you" and walk. Once you are in, the raises are on average at 2-3% if that. Make yourself the right smiling face for the right size pot 'o gold; but ALWAYS treat yourself as your own Business. You are in Business for yourself and your future.

[WideEye]

This is all so sadly true.... For a while I was searching,and I was offered a job at the CBS in Miami for 38k to start, and I was also offered a job in Orlando for 40k a year. That's horrible for markets 17 and 19.... Now I was fortunate, and after standing my ground and fighting for decent pay, I was eventually offered, and accepted a job in the tampa market which started in the mid 50's... Been happy ever since...

[McQueen]

I'll throw this out for comparison. Have a friend that drives the brown truck and leaves boxes on your step...he makes $60K+,his brother drives a brown semi for the same company...$100k. Not to shabby.

[Flairmarq]

I do know for a fact that one station in Miami is paying (there are guys in Miami who have been there for 10 plus years who are making over 75 grand a year) starting off at 28 grand a year.

This all sucks

Starting saleries for all photogs:
Tampa - 32 grand
Miami - 28 grand
Orlndo - 29 grand
West Palm - 23 grand
Jacksonvilee - 26 grand
Fort Myers - 27 grand

This all comes from friends who have taken jobs in these markets in the last six months. And they all are great photogs.

Not taken the job isn't the answer because both Miami and West Palm are now hiring guys fresh out of school and any of those salaries for a kid fresh out of school isn't too bad.


Ft. Myers is a bit high for starting. I got paid $23,500 starting and was raised to $24,500 in a year. This is at the lowest paying station in the market. I heard of photogs here making 26 grad, but that's about it for regular photogs.

I agree with the sunshine bit...you can't live off of it unless you have solar pannels.

It also depends on what company owns the station...

[NEWSSHOOTER3]

You should get 40-50k in Atlanta. I heard, just today, that Tampa is in the same neighborhood PLUS sunshine!

[lost focus]

the fort myers starting pay (27-28K) is about right if you are qualified and are working for either waterman or FOX (journal broadcasting) and they want you. All the stations have had a hard time attracting photogs and most have figured out that it you want people to stay more than one lease on their appartment they have to pony up more $$$. Still ain't enough to actually enjoy life while downthere.

[Mr MoOz]

What is sad, is across the board almost all photogs are basically underpaid for their talents. There are a few of us that are overpaid... not because of talent, but more the lack of or application of it.

When you look at all the different skills we practice on a daily basis it is a bit frustrating as to the pay scale.

[cameradog]

Although Florida markets often pay in sunshine, when comparing with salaries in other places you must adjust for the fact that there is no state income tax. That's a difference of anywhere from 1% to 10%.

For example, if you're considering a job that pays $30K in a state that has a 6% state income tax, the same job should pay $28,200 in Florida to provide the same net take-home pay. A $30K job in a state with a 9% state tax is the same as a $27,300 job in Florida.

And since it's a percentage, the difference only gets larger as the salary goes up. A $50K job in the 6% state is a $47K job in Florida. A $50K job in a 9% state is a $45,500 job in Florida. That last one is $4500 per year lower gross, but the same net take-home.

That certainly doesn't appear to close the gap entirely, but it does show that the first couple of thousand dollars of the gap may be justified in the market by the lower taxes.

[shade]

dog, you forgot to include the high cost of living in florida compared to those states with taxes....within the last few years housing has skyrockted almost to the point of the san francisco area.

[McQueen]

The legislature is talking about raising the sales tax from 6% to 8%...one of the highest in the nation.

[Lensmith]

Having just moved back into the "staff photog" world here in Miami after ten years freelancing...the above posts are hitting on all the positives and negatives of working in this part of the country.

That being said, I have to tell you I could not be happier. No staff job is ever perfect. We always want more money and, yes, things can be pricey here in Miami if you want to live on the beach or near the other tourist areas. That doesn't mean there aren't affordable, nice places to live.

Currently I'm in the process of figuring out whether I want to continue to rent or buy a home here. And in the interest of total honesty...my wife has a good paying job as well so I'm not the only "breadwinner" in the family. But to buy a home here is something I'm not sure I want to do. Prices right now are stupidly high. Toss in the property taxes and the constant threat of hurricanes and the needed insurance...I'm leaning towards continuing to rent rather than buying a home. Prices seem to be coming down, but I think they will continue to drop so I'm in no hurry to buy plus there are plenty of places to rent.

I worked ten years up north long ago in my career. Detroit for five years and Pittsburgh for five years. I had good times there but it was COLD! I decided I'd rather sweat than freeze any day. Plus there's no high heating bills here in Florida. The lack of a state income tax also is plus when it comes time to figure out whether the salary is worth it or not to move.

I love working in Miami because of the high number of crazy stories. Stuff I would never see or cover anywhere else...even in Tampa. Tampa is a higher market and, thus, should pay more for photogs. Each Miami station has it's pluses and minuses but, in the end, I feel good about being in a place that offers me good equipment and the chance to grow. By the way, the claim that they are offering thirty grand for staff photogs at the Miami stations is totally untrue. Ability is what counts and if you have the ability you will be offered well above thirty grand...and then count on lots of OT, if you want it, to push that number up even higher.

Plus I still get to do the international stuff and my Spanish that I picked up after living for ten years in Central America is not going to waste either.

At my current station we have several openings. I'm one who never feels I have to be best friends with the person who is my boss/supervisor...but I do like the operations chief where I'm at. He also happens to be a hell of a photog and a nice guy. Nope, not brown nosing here. Just making sure people know there are lots of opportunities for a photog looking to grow and learn, plus not get bored after four or five years covering the same county fair , traffic accidents or city council meetings.

Miami is not a bastion of NPPA style photography...any more than a war zone is a place to do cutting edge medical research. What you learn here is how to be a better news photographer. Covering stories fast, being as creative as possible in the time allowed while meeting deadlines. Rubbing elbows with lots of network folks and having future opportunities for professional growth. Like working in an Army MASH unit, the things you learn here set you above the rest in the long run. Pushing you up a level. Thinking and shooting in real news situations with pressure and rewards which you can parlay into better things if you have the desire. You may not win a lot of NPPA awards but you will never be bored...which is something I always had happen after being at a station for five years.

People can have a choice here. To either stay and make a home or go on to "better" places from here. Your work gets seen by those who count. Something that can't always be said about so many other parts of the country.

No, Florida is not for everyone. But don't make a decision strictly on salary based on where you live now. Florida is a place your abilities can move you ahead...if you truly have abilities.

Just my long winded thoughts. ;)

[Spot remover]

With respect to Shade, the cost of living in Florida is NOWHERE near the cost of living of the SF bay area.

How do I know? I grew up near SF and now live in Florida.

Example: In 1998, we bought our starter house (2 bed., 1 ba.- 880 sq. ft.) for $96,000. Five years later, we sold the house- with some improvements- for $198,000. Two years after that, the same house sold for $315,000. BTW, we went from that 2/1 house into a 2200sf 4 bed/3ba. house in FL for $30,000 less than we sold the CA house for.

Cost to register our new '98 Saturn in California? $514.
Cost to register that same car in Florida 5 years later? $43.

State income tax in California? Yup.
State income tax in Florida? No.

Granted, the cost of housing has gone up since then, but 3bd/2ba houses in SF are probably 150% more than comparable FL houses.

Am I in love with Florida? No, not particuarly. My family, history and heart all remain in California (I still say "back home" when referring to CA) But I simply cannot provide my family the same quality of life I can in Florida.

Maybe one day we'll move back, but not soon...

[SFX]

This may be a little off subject, but speaking of quality of life for your family, what do you all in Florida think about crime? It seems like Florida always has a number of cities on those most dangerous lists. Miami and Tampa come to mind.

[cameradog]

By the way, the claim that they are offering thirty grand for staff photogs at the Miami stations is totally untrue. Ability is what counts and if you have the ability you will be offered well above thirty grand...and then count on lots of OT, if you want it, to push that number up even higher.

I think you've made a substitution. Nobody is saying that no photog can expect more than $30K. They're saying that the starting salary is as low as $30K. It wouldn't surprise me at all to find that one of the stations in the market had offered someone with little experience $30K in the hopes of getting a photog on the cheap. All it takes is one station to start hiring inexperienced people and lowballing job candidates to move the starting salary lower.

Further, OT is NOT regular wages and is never guaranteed. It irks me to no end to hear that crap from a chief. Having to work ten extra hours per week to reach the same income as someone else who gets a higher base than you makes the offer worse, not better. Hearing a chief say that tells me that the chief and his company don't recognize my time outside work as having any value whatsoever. Further, the corporation doesn't give a rats ass that you depend on that OT to make ends meet when they hit hard times and cut or freeze OT. Overtime is NEVER--I repeat NEVER--an equitable substitute for base salary.

[Spot remover]

Sure, there's crime in Miami and Tampa. And Detroit...and Chicago...and LA...any large town, really.

But I don't live in any of those towns. I live in Ft. Myers.

Not a huge town. A little crime here and there and I live in a middle class bedroom community across the river.

Good for us!

[A Step Above Productions]

Overtime is NEVER--I repeat NEVER--an equitable substitute for base salary.

Well said – It always drove me crazy to hear the same thing. Back when I was a staffer I avoided OT as much as possible – I simply didn’t want it. I wanted to spend that time with my wife and son. Ya the “extra” money is and was nice. As you said why should we work extra to be able to survive?

[Lensmith]

I think you've made a substitution. Nobody is saying that no photog can expect more than $30K. They're saying that the starting salary is as low as $30K. It wouldn't surprise me at all to find that one of the stations in the market had offered someone with little experience $30K in the hopes of getting a photog on the cheap. All it takes is one station to start hiring inexperienced people and lowballing job candidates to move the starting salary lower..


My OT comment was just that. A comment. Maybe "one" station "might" be offering that low of a starting salary and I'll bet it's not an Enlgish language station. But I'm living here now and pretty familiar with all the stations and don't know any of them going that low...were you just guessing or do you have actual call letters to put along side that 3oK thought of yours? ;)

I know where I work they don't go that low for starting pay but I'll also admit it's hard to get photogs to move unless they feel they are getting a big bump in pay from their current location. Nothing wrong with feeling that way unless they are waiting for something which may never arrive.

With hurricane coverage a must in this market...I wouldn't advise anyone to expect to work here with having to pull their fair share of OT. No one works just 40 hours a week, every week, all year long. If a photog doesn't like OT then they shouldn't feel bad about staying right where they are. We all make the choices which make each individual happy.

Yeah, there's crime here in Miami. Keep your eyes open just like you would in any big city in any part of the US.

Being a photog in this market is a job. That's why they call it a "job". ;)

If you've got a good job now that you're happy with then you wouldn't be interested in moving anywhere anyway. We all want to make more money no matter where we work or how long we've been there. Do what you have to do to be happy and pay your bills. LIke I said, Miami and Florida are not for everyone. Just like other places, big and small, are not places I'd want to work for my own reasons. But to consider dollars made in a north eastern town or the west coast straight up to dollars made down south where you have fewer taxes and smaller heating bills...is comparing apples to oranges to me.

[cameradog]

But I'm living here now and pretty familiar with all the stations and don't know any of them going that low...were you just guessing or do you have actual call letters to put along side that 3oK thought of yours? ;)

The $30K figure came from your post. I didn't say anybody was paying that. I said that if someone claimed he had been offered $30K, I wouldn't be inclined to disbelieve it.

Flairmarq says he knows someone who was offered $28K. I'm not inclined to disbelieve him. If what he says is true, then starting salaries in Miami have dropped to $28K. It doesn't matter that your station pays better, or that people with more experience receive better.

With hurricane coverage a must in this market...I wouldn't advise anyone to expect to work here with having to pull their fair share of OT. No one works just 40 hours a week, every week, all year long. If a photog doesn't like OT then they shouldn't feel bad about staying right where they are. We all make the choices which make each individual happy.

The issue isn't whether or not someone wants to work overtime. I think most of us here are grown up enough to know that during a hurricane, you can expect to work overtime.

The issue is whether overtime is a substitute for base pay. It isn't. I have personally heard too many chiefs try to make that substitution. For example, about ten years ago I had a chief in West Palm tell me that although his station offered incoming photogs high $20s (!), I would easily make $40K per year with the overtime. He was trying to make it sound as though his station paid $40K as a starting salary. It didn't. (In fact, that particular station was owned by a company that not long afterward instituted a company-wide freeze on OT. There went that $40K he was selling.)

I had another chief in North Carolina ask me how much I wanted to take a job there before he would give me an offer. With my experience at that time, I felt as though I could reasonably ask for $35K. Then he offered me $28K instead. I somehow managed not to be insulted by that and simply explained that I couldn't possibly take the job for that kind of money. He, however, DID act offended, as though I were being completely unreasonable. He told me that with OT I would make $35K, so, in his words, "It's the same thing."

It's NOT the same thing. OT at that job should have been based on $35K, so that I would have been making well into the $40s if I had put in the hours he said would be required. What these chiefs think we're too stupid to realize is that the job with the higher base usually has the same (or more) opportunities for overtime, so that if I decline that $35K with OT job in favor of a job that has a $35K base, I would in fact be making well into the $40s for the same amount of work. They're using OT as an excuse to pay less, as an attempt at an end run around market forces that push the equilibrium price higher than their companies want to pay.

Thus, no photog in his right mind should accept a job based on what he might make in overtime. Did you know that loss of overtime is considered a major contributor to bankruptcy filings? People start doing well with overtime when companies are in a growth cycle and take on more obligations (car payments, house payments) than their base salary can support. When the company's growth slows, it freezes or cuts OT, and the employee can no longer afford the lifestyle to which he has become accustomed. Yet, chiefs routinely ask photogs to accept a job based on OT pay that they can't guarantee.

And even if the OT never goes away, it's terribly exhausting to work 50-60 hours a week for years, then realize that you've come to rely on that extra income and can't afford to take more time for yourself when you really need it.

I saw your overtime comment as significant because it reflects that same frame of mind. If you want to talk about how well Miami pays, don't talk about overtime. It's the base pay that is important.

[illpete]

I know a guy at an Orlando station that makes 44K a year and he's a bum.

[Lensmith]

C,dog,

My post was not to say "how well" Miami paid. It was just to give people an idea of WHAT Miami paid. In the scheme of things, I think it's lower than it should be but who among us doesn't think we deserve to be paid more no matter where we happen to work? However one can still have a nice life here in Miami. Whether their wife works or not.

It seems this OT thing hit a sore spot with you. Sorry for that.

Base pay is base pay. Take it or leave it to those looking for work.

From my point of view, I look at starting pay as just that. Starting. Where one goes from there is up to them. It begins there and those who are in other markets should honeslty look around and figure out if they have reached the peak of their salary possibilities before saying no to a lateral pay move.

Miami offers lots of other opportunities to change ones financial status outside of working for a local news station. Much more than most other places. Lots of production work here. Is it easy? No. But just having the possibilities nearby is a big plus compared to elsewhere.

By the way...Flairmarq was talking about Ft. Myers. Not Miami.

Another poster made a list of what he thought salaries were. It's why I piped in to give my perspective since I actually work in Miami and know quite a few folks at all the stations. Even the new Spanish language start ups who could be responsible for the low-ball starting figure. But you won't find that at the English language stations.

Anyone who counts on overtime and then runs up debt is foolish. I agree with you. But that's their choice. Their mistake. Their responsibility to live within their means.

North Carolina has a pretty low cost of living too. While you may have been offended by that chief's offer, you did what was best for you, and declined. Good for you. You must have found what and where you wanted to be.

Just like me.

You can't blame people for offering salaries that may not meet your standards of "acceptable". It's business. Nothing more. It's not personal.

Some chiefs are understandably frustrated when they can't hire people because the money they offer is not much different than what the applicant already makes. They're human just like you and me and I wouldn't be surprised if once in a while a chief might act out that frustration with a job applicant. It's not personal...unless you take it personally...which is kind of silly since it's "just business". Let them vent. You and I know what we are worth and what we will work for. We're the lucky ones. We don't have to deal with a negative response and now look for someone else to fill that full time spot at that pay scale...or maybe, just maybe, by us saying no we've helped someone else get what they deserve. Whether it's an even younger photog looking for a shot or a chief needing several turn-downs so he can go in and have some hard evidence for his higher ups that they need to budget more cash. But that's their problem. Not mine or yours.

Of course money is important but it is not the only thing. Especially if you are a younger photographer looking to grow and learn.

See, the opposite point can be made as well. Staying somewhere based only on your salary can lead to a career disaster too. Smaller markets are doing less and less as well. All of a sudden a photog who has passed up opportunities to move to other places, where there are a wider variety of opportunities to use their skills, is stuck. For whatever reason. Either out of concern for the dollar figure on their check or simple fear of change.

Then they are older. With more responsibilities of their own and now it's even harder for them to move. Now they've been in the same smaller market longer than others. The very big fish in a smaller pond and when they go to look for work because possibly their station has decided to downsize or limit them in some other way, they are at a much bigger disadvantage than if they had taken some calculated risk earlier in life.

I have always believed you have to ride this career like a wave. Sometimes a lateral move in terms of pay has other benefits which, in the long run, will lead you to long term success...instead of POSSIBLE short sighted decisions based on a too-narrow set of variables.

We are all free to make our own decisions about what is right for us. If money at the base salary level is a persons only concern then in my humble opinion they MAY be making a mistake. But that's life too. Not everyone is willing to take chances to succeed...and that's OK too. It makes it easier for others who do take chances.

There are no guarantees. Even base salaries can go lower without warning. Or jobs...just get eliminated. I'm suggesting photogs, when looking for that next move, think more "big picture". More long term. Where can you grow and where will you stagnate?

Where would you want to be if the worst happened? In the middle of nowhere or somewhere that offered viable options for you to use you hard earned skills? Certainly not in a place that, at best, only has one or two TV stations which might or might not being doing local news.

But that's just me. ;)

[shade]

Lens,

I agree with most of you're points but to make a statement like "the spanish start ups could be responsible for the low ball" is wrong....I'm the chief at one of the spanish start ups and I can tell you that my lowest paid photog starts out in the low 30's. I know for a fact you're live truck ops which by the way are sometimes used to shoot make less than that. Alittle history on the miami market, wsvn brought everyone down in salary when they went indie in the late 80's (now they've caught up) so the responsibility for low ball can be pinned to Joel Cheatwood. other than that you are dead on.

[Lensmith]

Lens,

I agree with most of you're points but to make a statement like "the spanish start ups could be responsible for the low ball" is wrong....I'm the chief at one of the spanish start ups and I can tell you that my lowest paid photog starts out in the low 30's. I know for a fact you're live truck ops which by the way are sometimes used to shoot make less than that. Alittle history on the miami market, wsvn brought everyone down in salary when they went indie in the late 80's (now they've caught up) so the responsibility for low ball can be pinned to Joel Cheatwood. other than that you are dead on.

Shade, I owe you and your station an apology.

I was just guessing about who might be offering that low a salary and had no firm reason to pin it on the Spanish language stations.

Again, I'm sorry.

I agree with you about the WSVN influence here. It's disappointing to me, if it's true, that they are offering that low of a start-pay. I know their chief. A pretty good guy who has talent. I still wonder if this claim of a 30 grand starting salary is nothing more than rumor but...

Thanks for setting me straight.

Live truck ops at my station don't make photog pay.

We had one guy at my place, an early morning live truck op, who switched to shooting. But he's now on leave and the truck ops, generally speaking, have little or no real camera experience. That was the reason for the lower salary in that one, individual case...though he's a very good guy with a lot of promise. At present, he's on personal leave so we don't have any live truck ops shooting on a daily basis...unless it's some odd emergency situation where someone is sick or we're really short handed...and, even then, it's only until they can get a regular photog in to shoot.

[C St. SW]

And even if the OT never goes away, it's terribly exhausting to work 50-60 hours a week for years......

Amen to this!

When I left my last station, I told my ND (when she asked why) one of the major reasons was 5+ years of averaging 300-400 hours of overtime each year. Produce more, longer hours, fewer people. It wasn't always like that. The longer I stayed in local news, each year, the hours worked went up with no end in sight.

Yeah, the money was great, but the shear number of hours seriously cut down on "life" time. Plus, the constant harassment from the ex demanding more money based on her opinion of what my overtime was.....well, it was just one more incentive to move on.

[perro17]

i'm currently working in miami ( spanish station ) for about 49k but is nothing for the miami area!

[Flairmarq]

the fort myers starting pay (27-28K) is about right if you are qualified and are working for either waterman or FOX (journal broadcasting) and they want you. All the stations have had a hard time attracting photogs and most have figured out that it you want people to stay more than one lease on their appartment they have to pony up more $$$. Still ain't enough to actually enjoy life while downthere.

Journal doesn't pay squat to any of us---hense the mass exodus here. Most I can say is $25,500 for our station.

[Frank McBride]

It does seem most of the fast-growing markets are southern and southwestern. In the past I have seen people glad their market size had gone up with the new Nielson rankings, but does that really translate into higher pay?

Has anyone experienced a direct pay increase due to an increase in market size? It seems like the only way that would happen is if competition heated up between stations for good people. Rarely does a company raise pay when it doesn't have to.

Along those lines, plenty of markets increased their households without moving up in ranking. That still translates into a chance to charge higher ad rates which logically COULD be passed on to employees, but is it? Again, I doubt it.

FMc

[cameradog]

Has anyone experienced a direct pay increase due to an increase in market size?

When the Birmingham, Anniston and Tuscaloosa markets in north/central Alabama were collapsed into one big market, Birmingham went from market 59 to market 39 overnight. Suddenly the ad sales were worth a lot more. Because the airtime was worth more, the owners were willing at first to invest some money to ramp up competition.

Part of competing was keeping their good employees and attracting new ones, so the salaries did go up. Someone looking to make a jump to a top 50 market would compare the salaries offered with other salaries in the same market range. When Birmingham became market 39, the salaries had to compare favorably with Nashville and similar sized cities. If they continued to offer market 59 wages, the job candidates they wanted would go to those other cities instead. There was also a fairly recent startup in town around that time that was rapidly building up its newsroom, so the other newsrooms had to do what they could to keep people from taking better money there, as well.

That's more dramatic than most market jumps, but it illustrates that it DOES happen. If your market jumps ten spots, you probably won't get a raise. But the pay for new people coming into the market will start inching up, because if it doesn't, the qualified people will go to other similar sized markets. You may also actually get cost of living raises that would have been smaller or frozen otherwise, to keep you from leaving.

When you and your colleagues start finding out that newer people are making more than you, you'll all start to look for other opportunities. If you're good, other stations in town will be willing to pay you more to go across the street. Then your former employer will have to pay more to new people coming in to replace you. At some point maybe they'll be willing to make a current employee an even better offer than the competition to induce him to stay.

You may not see an immediate benefit, but you should see it over time. If not, leave for something better, even in the same town.